15K vs. SSD Drives

True. The loophole in RAID 5 is multiple concurrent drive failures since it is a single parity scheme. Adding the additional parity bit as RAID 6 does protects from multiple drive failures but at the price of further reduction in write performance as it has to write twice as many parity bits. So, if the vendor is admonishing against the use of RAID 5 already, they would really object to RAID 6. To be honest, I have yet to test real world performance with SSD's in a RAID 6 configuration but, since most of the write transactions are fairly small, I would suspect that the only area where you might take a hit would be things like MRP regen or WIP capture where there is significant write traffic.


Michael

Michael Barry
Aspacia Systems Inc
866.566.9600
312.803.0730 fax
http://www.aspacia.com/


On Feb 27, 2012, at 8:37 AM, Zac Jason Woodward wrote:

> It is still extremely discouraged to do RAID 5 if it is avoidable. If you don't want to RAID 10 it would be worth looking into RAID 6. RAID 5 still has the loophole in it that can make a failure unrecoverable. With the performance benefit that SSD brings to the table RAID 6 is a viable option if you purchase a good controller card.
>
> "Zac" Jason Woodward
> Network Administrator
> Intermountain Electronics, Inc.
> O: 877-544-2291
> M: 435-820-6515
> F: 435-637-9601
> www.ie-corp.com
>
> Creating customer confidence through extraordinary service and experienced industry experts.
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Driggers
> Sent: Monday, February 27, 2012 9:25 AM
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [Vantage] 15K vs. SSD Drives
>
> Good point about the raid 5. In the beginning I'd kept mine on raid 10 not for performance as much as the reliability issues with some of the early SSDs coupled with the fact that our space requirements were pretty minimal.
>
> It seems like the reliability issues have mostly been sorted out with the newer drives.
>
> On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 11:18 AM, Michael Barry <mbarry@...> wrote:
>
> > **
> >
> >
> > Not only do you get a massive IOPS advantage but, perhaps just as
> > important, you get a 1000 fold faster latency number. As a result,
> > even the smallest queries display a remarkably improved response time.
> > So much so, in fact, that just as you have observed you can absorb the
> > additional overhead of virtualization and still see a significant
> > improvement in system performance.
> >
> > An additional benefit of the write performance is that, if you are so
> > inclined, you can pretty much abandon the whole raid 5 prohibition and
> > get back some underutilized drive space...
> >
> > Michael
> >
> > Michael Barry
> > Aspacia Systems Inc
> > 866.566.9600
> > 312.803.0730 fax
> > http://www.aspacia.com/
> >
> >
> > On Feb 27, 2012, at 6:24 AM, John Driggers wrote:
> >
> > > We did a few measurements, unfortunately I don't seem to have the
> > > numbers anymore. However a quick google search should net you
> > > countless studies/tests/benchmarks that show the massive IOPS
> > > advantage that SSDs hold over traditional disks.
> > >
> > > Our database is inside a virtual disk, which as you probably know
> > > already isn't recommended for performance. However our load wasn't
> > > heavy enough
> > to
> > > justify a more complex storage arrangement. That said, we're
> > > currently running our Epicor install (DB and all) on 4 SSDs in Raid
> > > 10. We
> > previously
> > > had the DB running (non-virtual) on 6 15k SCSI drives in a RAID 10.
> > > Even after the virtualization overhead, the performance increase is massive.
> > >
> > >
> > > On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 7:26 AM, markbetts66
> > ><mbetts@...
> > >wrote:
> > >
> > >> **
> >
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> Hi,
> > >>
> > >> do you have any numbers at all for the performance improvement? Is
> > >> your data base visualised too? which version of vantage are you running?
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, John Driggers <waffqle@...> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> We are virtualized, so we gauged most of our performance by the
> > >>> time it took to complete requests. Most of our IO bound loads were
> > >>> were cut in half.
> > >>> Our average disk queue length is pretty much always <1.
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:42 PM, cubcrafters_it <
> > >>> jason.navarrete@...> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>>> **
> > >>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> I too, would like to know where the differences were seen. Any
> > >> benchmarks
> > >>>> ran?
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, Jose Gomez <jose@> wrote:
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> 8 Drives.. I can't remember exactly what we had there before,
> > >>>>> its
> > >> been a
> > >>>>> while. I'll deffer to John he may remember
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> *Jose C Gomez*
> > >>>>> *Software Engineer*
> > >>>>> *
> > >>>>> *
> > >>>>> *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> > >>>>> *
> > >>>>> *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> > >>>>> E: jose@
> > >>>>
> > >>>>> http://www.josecgomez.com
> > >>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <
> > >>>> http://www.facebook.com/josegomez>
> > >>>>> <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <
> > >>>> http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> > >>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> > >>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/> <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:07 PM, Vantage <vantage@> wrote:
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>> **
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> How many SSD drives do you have total running? And compared to
> > >> what?
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> -----Original Message-----
> > >>>>>> From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com]
> > >>>>>> On
> > >>>> Behalf
> > >>>>>> Of Jose Gomez
> > >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 11:56 AM
> > >>>>>> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> > >>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vantage] 15K vs. SSD Drives
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> When we moved to SSD's it make a HUGE difference.
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> *Jose C Gomez*
> > >>>>>> *Software Engineer*
> > >>>>>> *
> > >>>>>> *
> > >>>>>> *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> > >>>>>> *
> > >>>>>> *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> > >>>>>> E: jose@
> > >>>>
> > >>>>>> http://www.josecgomez.com
> > >>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <
> > >>>> http://www.facebook.com/josegomez
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>> <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <
> > >>>> http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> > >>>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> > >>>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/> <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 12:48 PM, Vantage <vantage@> wrote:
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> **
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> Just a general question. When looking at servers. Epicor wants
> > >> more
> > >>>>>>> spindles. SSD drives are more expensive, but much faster.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> What option would you go with?
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> Option 1 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal SSD
> > >> drives.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> Option 2 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal -
> > >>>>>>> 15K spindle drives and a DAS filled with a 15 - 15K drives?
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> Joe Sanders
> > >>>>>>> Wipaire, Inc.
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> ------------------------------------
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>> Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note:
> > >>>>>> You
> > >> must
> > >>>> have
> > >>>>>> already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable
> > >>>>>> access. )
> > >>>>>> (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report
> > >> Builder
> > >>>> and
> > >>>>>> Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> > >>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> > >>>>>> (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> > >>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> > >>>>>> (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> > >>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >>>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>> --
> > >>> *John Driggers*
> > >>> *High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
> > >>> *
> > >>> **:: 904.404.9233*
> > >>> *:: waffqle@...*
> > >>> *:: NO FAXES*
> > >>>
> > >>> *
> > >>
> > >>>
> > >>> *
> > >>>
> > >>>
> > >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >>>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > *John Driggers*
> > > *High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
> > > *
> > > **:: 904.404.9233*
> > > *:: waffqle@...*
> >
> > > *:: NO FAXES*
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > > *
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------
> > >
> > > Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You
> > > must
> > have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access.
> > )
> > > (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report
> > > Builder
> > and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> > > (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> > > (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> *John Driggers*
> *High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
> *
> **:: 904.404.9233*
> *:: waffqle@...*
> *:: NO FAXES*
>
> *
>
> *
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> (2) To search through old msg's goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
>
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Just a general question. When looking at servers. Epicor wants more spindles. SSD drives are more expensive, but much faster.

What option would you go with?

Option 1 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal SSD drives.

Option 2 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal - 15K spindle drives and a DAS filled with a 15 - 15K drives?

Joe Sanders
Wipaire, Inc.


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
When we moved to SSD's it make a HUGE difference.

*Jose C Gomez*
*Software Engineer*
*
*
*checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
*
*T: 904.469.1524 mobile
E: jose@...
http://www.josecgomez.com
<http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <http://www.facebook.com/josegomez>
<http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
<http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
<http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
<http://www.usdoingstuff.com>

*Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*



On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 12:48 PM, Vantage <vantage@...> wrote:

> **
>
>
> Just a general question. When looking at servers. Epicor wants more
> spindles. SSD drives are more expensive, but much faster.
>
> What option would you go with?
>
> Option 1 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal SSD drives.
>
> Option 2 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal - 15K spindle
> drives and a DAS filled with a 15 - 15K drives?
>
> Joe Sanders
> Wipaire, Inc.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
How many SSD drives do you have total running? And compared to what?

-----Original Message-----
From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Jose Gomez
Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 11:56 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Vantage] 15K vs. SSD Drives

When we moved to SSD's it make a HUGE difference.

*Jose C Gomez*
*Software Engineer*
*
*
*checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
*
*T: 904.469.1524 mobile
E: jose@...
http://www.josecgomez.com
<http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <http://www.facebook.com/josegomez>
<http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
<http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
<http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
<http://www.usdoingstuff.com>

*Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*



On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 12:48 PM, Vantage <vantage@...> wrote:

> **
>
>
> Just a general question. When looking at servers. Epicor wants more
> spindles. SSD drives are more expensive, but much faster.
>
> What option would you go with?
>
> Option 1 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal SSD drives.
>
> Option 2 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal - 15K
> spindle drives and a DAS filled with a 15 - 15K drives?
>
> Joe Sanders
> Wipaire, Inc.
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
8 Drives.. I can't remember exactly what we had there before, its been a
while. I'll deffer to John he may remember

*Jose C Gomez*
*Software Engineer*
*
*
*checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
*
*T: 904.469.1524 mobile
E: jose@...
http://www.josecgomez.com
<http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <http://www.facebook.com/josegomez>
<http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
<http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
<http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
<http://www.usdoingstuff.com>

*Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*



On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:07 PM, Vantage <vantage@...> wrote:

> **
>
>
> How many SSD drives do you have total running? And compared to what?
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
> Of Jose Gomez
> Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 11:56 AM
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: Re: [Vantage] 15K vs. SSD Drives
>
> When we moved to SSD's it make a HUGE difference.
>
> *Jose C Gomez*
> *Software Engineer*
> *
> *
> *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> *
> *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> E: jose@...
> http://www.josecgomez.com
> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <http://www.facebook.com/josegomez
> >
> <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
> <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
>
> *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 12:48 PM, Vantage <vantage@...> wrote:
>
> > **
>
> >
> >
> > Just a general question. When looking at servers. Epicor wants more
> > spindles. SSD drives are more expensive, but much faster.
> >
> > What option would you go with?
> >
> > Option 1 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal SSD drives.
> >
> > Option 2 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal - 15K
> > spindle drives and a DAS filled with a 15 - 15K drives?
> >
> > Joe Sanders
> > Wipaire, Inc.
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
> ------------------------------------
>
>
> Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
> already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
> Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I too, would like to know where the differences were seen. Any benchmarks ran?

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, Jose Gomez <jose@...> wrote:
>
> 8 Drives.. I can't remember exactly what we had there before, its been a
> while. I'll deffer to John he may remember
>
> *Jose C Gomez*
> *Software Engineer*
> *
> *
> *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> *
> *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> E: jose@...
> http://www.josecgomez.com
> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <http://www.facebook.com/josegomez>
> <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
> <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
>
> *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:07 PM, Vantage <vantage@...> wrote:
>
> > **
> >
> >
> > How many SSD drives do you have total running? And compared to what?
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
> > Of Jose Gomez
> > Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 11:56 AM
> > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> > Subject: Re: [Vantage] 15K vs. SSD Drives
> >
> > When we moved to SSD's it make a HUGE difference.
> >
> > *Jose C Gomez*
> > *Software Engineer*
> > *
> > *
> > *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> > *
> > *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> > E: jose@...
> > http://www.josecgomez.com
> > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <http://www.facebook.com/josegomez
> > >
> > <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> > <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> > <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
> > <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
> >
> > *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 12:48 PM, Vantage <vantage@...> wrote:
> >
> > > **
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Just a general question. When looking at servers. Epicor wants more
> > > spindles. SSD drives are more expensive, but much faster.
> > >
> > > What option would you go with?
> > >
> > > Option 1 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal SSD drives.
> > >
> > > Option 2 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal - 15K
> > > spindle drives and a DAS filled with a 15 - 15K drives?
> > >
> > > Joe Sanders
> > > Wipaire, Inc.
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> >
> > Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have
> > already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> > (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and
> > Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> > (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> > (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
We are virtualized, so we gauged most of our performance by the time it
took to complete requests. Most of our IO bound loads were were cut in
half.
Our average disk queue length is pretty much always <1.



On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:42 PM, cubcrafters_it <
jason.navarrete@...> wrote:

> **
>
>
> I too, would like to know where the differences were seen. Any benchmarks
> ran?
>
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, Jose Gomez <jose@...> wrote:
> >
> > 8 Drives.. I can't remember exactly what we had there before, its been a
> > while. I'll deffer to John he may remember
> >
> > *Jose C Gomez*
> > *Software Engineer*
> > *
> > *
> > *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> > *
> > *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> > E: jose@...
>
> > http://www.josecgomez.com
> > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <
> http://www.facebook.com/josegomez>
> > <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <
> http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> > <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> > <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
> > <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
> >
> > *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:07 PM, Vantage <vantage@...> wrote:
> >
> > > **
> > >
> > >
> > > How many SSD drives do you have total running? And compared to what?
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On
> Behalf
> > > Of Jose Gomez
> > > Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 11:56 AM
> > > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> > > Subject: Re: [Vantage] 15K vs. SSD Drives
> > >
> > > When we moved to SSD's it make a HUGE difference.
> > >
> > > *Jose C Gomez*
> > > *Software Engineer*
> > > *
> > > *
> > > *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> > > *
> > > *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> > > E: jose@...
>
> > > http://www.josecgomez.com
> > > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <
> http://www.facebook.com/josegomez
> > > >
> > > <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <
> http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> > > <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> > > <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
> > > <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
> > >
> > > *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
> > >
> > >
> > > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 12:48 PM, Vantage <vantage@...> wrote:
> > >
> > > > **
> > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Just a general question. When looking at servers. Epicor wants more
> > > > spindles. SSD drives are more expensive, but much faster.
> > > >
> > > > What option would you go with?
> > > >
> > > > Option 1 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal SSD drives.
> > > >
> > > > Option 2 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal - 15K
> > > > spindle drives and a DAS filled with a 15 - 15K drives?
> > > >
> > > > Joe Sanders
> > > > Wipaire, Inc.
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> > > ------------------------------------
> > >
> > >
> > > Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must
> have
> > > already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> > > (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder
> and
> > > Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> > > (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> > > (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
>



--
*John Driggers*
*High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
*
**:: 904.404.9233*
*:: waffqle@...*
*:: NO FAXES*

*

*


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Hi,

do you have any numbers at all for the performance improvement? Is your data base visualised too? which version of vantage are you running?

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, John Driggers <waffqle@...> wrote:
>
> We are virtualized, so we gauged most of our performance by the time it
> took to complete requests. Most of our IO bound loads were were cut in
> half.
> Our average disk queue length is pretty much always <1.
>
>
>
> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:42 PM, cubcrafters_it <
> jason.navarrete@...> wrote:
>
> > **
> >
> >
> > I too, would like to know where the differences were seen. Any benchmarks
> > ran?
> >
> >
> > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, Jose Gomez <jose@> wrote:
> > >
> > > 8 Drives.. I can't remember exactly what we had there before, its been a
> > > while. I'll deffer to John he may remember
> > >
> > > *Jose C Gomez*
> > > *Software Engineer*
> > > *
> > > *
> > > *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> > > *
> > > *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> > > E: jose@
> >
> > > http://www.josecgomez.com
> > > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <
> > http://www.facebook.com/josegomez>
> > > <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <
> > http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> > > <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> > > <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
> > > <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
> > >
> > > *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:07 PM, Vantage <vantage@> wrote:
> > >
> > > > **
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > How many SSD drives do you have total running? And compared to what?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On
> > Behalf
> > > > Of Jose Gomez
> > > > Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 11:56 AM
> > > > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> > > > Subject: Re: [Vantage] 15K vs. SSD Drives
> > > >
> > > > When we moved to SSD's it make a HUGE difference.
> > > >
> > > > *Jose C Gomez*
> > > > *Software Engineer*
> > > > *
> > > > *
> > > > *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> > > > *
> > > > *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> > > > E: jose@
> >
> > > > http://www.josecgomez.com
> > > > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <
> > http://www.facebook.com/josegomez
> > > > >
> > > > <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <
> > http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> > > > <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> > > > <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
> > > > <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
> > > >
> > > > *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 12:48 PM, Vantage <vantage@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > **
> > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Just a general question. When looking at servers. Epicor wants more
> > > > > spindles. SSD drives are more expensive, but much faster.
> > > > >
> > > > > What option would you go with?
> > > > >
> > > > > Option 1 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal SSD drives.
> > > > >
> > > > > Option 2 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal - 15K
> > > > > spindle drives and a DAS filled with a 15 - 15K drives?
> > > > >
> > > > > Joe Sanders
> > > > > Wipaire, Inc.
> > > > >
> > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > > > ------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must
> > have
> > > > already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> > > > (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder
> > and
> > > > Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> > > > (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> > > > (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>
> --
> *John Driggers*
> *High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
> *
> **:: 904.404.9233*
> *:: waffqle@...*
> *:: NO FAXES*
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
We did a few measurements, unfortunately I don't seem to have the numbers
anymore. However a quick google search should net you countless
studies/tests/benchmarks that show the massive IOPS advantage that SSDs
hold over traditional disks.

Our database is inside a virtual disk, which as you probably know already
isn't recommended for performance. However our load wasn't heavy enough to
justify a more complex storage arrangement. That said, we're currently
running our Epicor install (DB and all) on 4 SSDs in Raid 10. We previously
had the DB running (non-virtual) on 6 15k SCSI drives in a RAID 10. Even
after the virtualization overhead, the performance increase is massive.


On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 7:26 AM, markbetts66 <mbetts@...>wrote:

> **
>
>
> Hi,
>
> do you have any numbers at all for the performance improvement? Is your
> data base visualised too? which version of vantage are you running?
>
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, John Driggers <waffqle@...> wrote:
> >
> > We are virtualized, so we gauged most of our performance by the time it
> > took to complete requests. Most of our IO bound loads were were cut in
> > half.
> > Our average disk queue length is pretty much always <1.
> >
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:42 PM, cubcrafters_it <
> > jason.navarrete@...> wrote:
> >
> > > **
>
> > >
> > >
> > > I too, would like to know where the differences were seen. Any
> benchmarks
> > > ran?
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, Jose Gomez <jose@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > 8 Drives.. I can't remember exactly what we had there before, its
> been a
> > > > while. I'll deffer to John he may remember
> > > >
> > > > *Jose C Gomez*
> > > > *Software Engineer*
> > > > *
> > > > *
> > > > *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> > > > *
> > > > *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> > > > E: jose@
> > >
> > > > http://www.josecgomez.com
> > > > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <
> > > http://www.facebook.com/josegomez>
> > > > <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <
> > > http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> > > > <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> > > > <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
> > > > <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
> > > >
> > > > *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:07 PM, Vantage <vantage@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > **
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > How many SSD drives do you have total running? And compared to
> what?
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > > From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On
> > > Behalf
> > > > > Of Jose Gomez
> > > > > Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 11:56 AM
> > > > > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> > > > > Subject: Re: [Vantage] 15K vs. SSD Drives
> > > > >
> > > > > When we moved to SSD's it make a HUGE difference.
> > > > >
> > > > > *Jose C Gomez*
> > > > > *Software Engineer*
> > > > > *
> > > > > *
> > > > > *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> > > > > *
> > > > > *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> > > > > E: jose@
> > >
> > > > > http://www.josecgomez.com
> > > > > <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <
> > > http://www.facebook.com/josegomez
> > > > > >
> > > > > <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <
> > > http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> > > > > <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> > > > > <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
> > > > > <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
> > > > >
> > > > > *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 12:48 PM, Vantage <vantage@> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > **
> > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Just a general question. When looking at servers. Epicor wants
> more
> > > > > > spindles. SSD drives are more expensive, but much faster.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > What option would you go with?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Option 1 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal SSD
> drives.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Option 2 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal - 15K
> > > > > > spindle drives and a DAS filled with a 15 - 15K drives?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Joe Sanders
> > > > > > Wipaire, Inc.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > > >
> > > > > ------------------------------------
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You
> must
> > > have
> > > > > already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> > > > > (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report
> Builder
> > > and
> > > > > Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> > > > > (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> > > > > (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> > > > > http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > *John Driggers*
> > *High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
> > *
> > **:: 904.404.9233*
> > *:: waffqle@...*
> > *:: NO FAXES*
> >
> > *
>
> >
> > *
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
>



--
*John Driggers*
*High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
*
**:: 904.404.9233*
*:: waffqle@...*
*:: NO FAXES*

*

*


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Not only do you get a massive IOPS advantage but, perhaps just as important, you get a 1000 fold faster latency number. As a result, even the smallest queries display a remarkably improved response time. So much so, in fact, that just as you have observed you can absorb the additional overhead of virtualization and still see a significant improvement in system performance.

An additional benefit of the write performance is that, if you are so inclined, you can pretty much abandon the whole raid 5 prohibition and get back some underutilized drive space...


Michael

Michael Barry
Aspacia Systems Inc
866.566.9600
312.803.0730 fax
http://www.aspacia.com/

On Feb 27, 2012, at 6:24 AM, John Driggers wrote:

> We did a few measurements, unfortunately I don't seem to have the numbers
> anymore. However a quick google search should net you countless
> studies/tests/benchmarks that show the massive IOPS advantage that SSDs
> hold over traditional disks.
>
> Our database is inside a virtual disk, which as you probably know already
> isn't recommended for performance. However our load wasn't heavy enough to
> justify a more complex storage arrangement. That said, we're currently
> running our Epicor install (DB and all) on 4 SSDs in Raid 10. We previously
> had the DB running (non-virtual) on 6 15k SCSI drives in a RAID 10. Even
> after the virtualization overhead, the performance increase is massive.
>
>
> On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 7:26 AM, markbetts66 <mbetts@...>wrote:
>
>> **
>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> do you have any numbers at all for the performance improvement? Is your
>> data base visualised too? which version of vantage are you running?
>>
>>
>> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, John Driggers <waffqle@...> wrote:
>>>
>>> We are virtualized, so we gauged most of our performance by the time it
>>> took to complete requests. Most of our IO bound loads were were cut in
>>> half.
>>> Our average disk queue length is pretty much always <1.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:42 PM, cubcrafters_it <
>>> jason.navarrete@...> wrote:
>>>
>>>> **
>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I too, would like to know where the differences were seen. Any
>> benchmarks
>>>> ran?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, Jose Gomez <jose@> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> 8 Drives.. I can't remember exactly what we had there before, its
>> been a
>>>>> while. I'll deffer to John he may remember
>>>>>
>>>>> *Jose C Gomez*
>>>>> *Software Engineer*
>>>>> *
>>>>> *
>>>>> *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
>>>>> *
>>>>> *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
>>>>> E: jose@
>>>>
>>>>> http://www.josecgomez.com
>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <
>>>> http://www.facebook.com/josegomez>
>>>>> <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <
>>>> http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
>>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
>>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
>>>>> <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
>>>>>
>>>>> *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:07 PM, Vantage <vantage@> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> **
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> How many SSD drives do you have total running? And compared to
>> what?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On
>>>> Behalf
>>>>>> Of Jose Gomez
>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 11:56 AM
>>>>>> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vantage] 15K vs. SSD Drives
>>>>>>
>>>>>> When we moved to SSD's it make a HUGE difference.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Jose C Gomez*
>>>>>> *Software Engineer*
>>>>>> *
>>>>>> *
>>>>>> *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
>>>>>> *
>>>>>> *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
>>>>>> E: jose@
>>>>
>>>>>> http://www.josecgomez.com
>>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <
>>>> http://www.facebook.com/josegomez
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <
>>>> http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
>>>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
>>>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
>>>>>> <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 12:48 PM, Vantage <vantage@> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> **
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Just a general question. When looking at servers. Epicor wants
>> more
>>>>>>> spindles. SSD drives are more expensive, but much faster.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> What option would you go with?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Option 1 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal SSD
>> drives.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Option 2 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal - 15K
>>>>>>> spindle drives and a DAS filled with a 15 - 15K drives?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Joe Sanders
>>>>>>> Wipaire, Inc.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------------------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You
>> must
>>>> have
>>>>>> already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
>>>>>> (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report
>> Builder
>>>> and
>>>>>> Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
>>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
>>>>>> (2) To search through old msg's goto:
>>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
>>>>>> (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
>>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> *John Driggers*
>>> *High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
>>> *
>>> **:: 904.404.9233*
>>> *:: waffqle@...*
>>> *:: NO FAXES*
>>>
>>> *
>>
>>>
>>> *
>>>
>>>
>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> *John Driggers*
> *High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
> *
> **:: 904.404.9233*
> *:: waffqle@...*
> *:: NO FAXES*
>
> *
>
> *
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------
>
> Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> (2) To search through old msg's goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Good point about the raid 5. In the beginning I'd kept mine on raid 10 not
for performance as much as the reliability issues with some of the early
SSDs coupled with the fact that our space requirements were pretty minimal.

It seems like the reliability issues have mostly been sorted out with the
newer drives.

On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 11:18 AM, Michael Barry <mbarry@...> wrote:

> **
>
>
> Not only do you get a massive IOPS advantage but, perhaps just as
> important, you get a 1000 fold faster latency number. As a result, even the
> smallest queries display a remarkably improved response time. So much so,
> in fact, that just as you have observed you can absorb the additional
> overhead of virtualization and still see a significant improvement in
> system performance.
>
> An additional benefit of the write performance is that, if you are so
> inclined, you can pretty much abandon the whole raid 5 prohibition and get
> back some underutilized drive space...
>
> Michael
>
> Michael Barry
> Aspacia Systems Inc
> 866.566.9600
> 312.803.0730 fax
> http://www.aspacia.com/
>
>
> On Feb 27, 2012, at 6:24 AM, John Driggers wrote:
>
> > We did a few measurements, unfortunately I don't seem to have the numbers
> > anymore. However a quick google search should net you countless
> > studies/tests/benchmarks that show the massive IOPS advantage that SSDs
> > hold over traditional disks.
> >
> > Our database is inside a virtual disk, which as you probably know already
> > isn't recommended for performance. However our load wasn't heavy enough
> to
> > justify a more complex storage arrangement. That said, we're currently
> > running our Epicor install (DB and all) on 4 SSDs in Raid 10. We
> previously
> > had the DB running (non-virtual) on 6 15k SCSI drives in a RAID 10. Even
> > after the virtualization overhead, the performance increase is massive.
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 7:26 AM, markbetts66 <mbetts@...
> >wrote:
> >
> >> **
>
> >>
> >>
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> do you have any numbers at all for the performance improvement? Is your
> >> data base visualised too? which version of vantage are you running?
> >>
> >>
> >> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, John Driggers <waffqle@...> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> We are virtualized, so we gauged most of our performance by the time it
> >>> took to complete requests. Most of our IO bound loads were were cut in
> >>> half.
> >>> Our average disk queue length is pretty much always <1.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:42 PM, cubcrafters_it <
> >>> jason.navarrete@...> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> **
> >>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> I too, would like to know where the differences were seen. Any
> >> benchmarks
> >>>> ran?
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, Jose Gomez <jose@> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 8 Drives.. I can't remember exactly what we had there before, its
> >> been a
> >>>>> while. I'll deffer to John he may remember
> >>>>>
> >>>>> *Jose C Gomez*
> >>>>> *Software Engineer*
> >>>>> *
> >>>>> *
> >>>>> *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> >>>>> *
> >>>>> *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> >>>>> E: jose@
> >>>>
> >>>>> http://www.josecgomez.com
> >>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <
> >>>> http://www.facebook.com/josegomez>
> >>>>> <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <
> >>>> http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> >>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> >>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
> >>>>> <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:07 PM, Vantage <vantage@> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> **
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> How many SSD drives do you have total running? And compared to
> >> what?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>>>> From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On
> >>>> Behalf
> >>>>>> Of Jose Gomez
> >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 11:56 AM
> >>>>>> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> >>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vantage] 15K vs. SSD Drives
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> When we moved to SSD's it make a HUGE difference.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> *Jose C Gomez*
> >>>>>> *Software Engineer*
> >>>>>> *
> >>>>>> *
> >>>>>> *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> >>>>>> *
> >>>>>> *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> >>>>>> E: jose@
> >>>>
> >>>>>> http://www.josecgomez.com
> >>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <
> >>>> http://www.facebook.com/josegomez
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>> <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <
> >>>> http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> >>>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> >>>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/>
> >>>>>> <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 12:48 PM, Vantage <vantage@> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> **
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Just a general question. When looking at servers. Epicor wants
> >> more
> >>>>>>> spindles. SSD drives are more expensive, but much faster.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> What option would you go with?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Option 1 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal SSD
> >> drives.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Option 2 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal - 15K
> >>>>>>> spindle drives and a DAS filled with a 15 - 15K drives?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Joe Sanders
> >>>>>>> Wipaire, Inc.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ------------------------------------
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You
> >> must
> >>>> have
> >>>>>> already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> >>>>>> (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report
> >> Builder
> >>>> and
> >>>>>> Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> >>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> >>>>>> (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> >>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> >>>>>> (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> >>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> *John Driggers*
> >>> *High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
> >>> *
> >>> **:: 904.404.9233*
> >>> *:: waffqle@...*
> >>> *:: NO FAXES*
> >>>
> >>> *
> >>
> >>>
> >>> *
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > *John Driggers*
> > *High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
> > *
> > **:: 904.404.9233*
> > *:: waffqle@...*
>
> > *:: NO FAXES*
> >
> > *
> >
> > *
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must
> have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
> > (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder
> and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> > (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> > (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>



--
*John Driggers*
*High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
*
**:: 904.404.9233*
*:: waffqle@...*
*:: NO FAXES*

*

*


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
It is still extremely discouraged to do RAID 5 if it is avoidable. If you don't want to RAID 10 it would be worth looking into RAID 6. RAID 5 still has the loophole in it that can make a failure unrecoverable. With the performance benefit that SSD brings to the table RAID 6 is a viable option if you purchase a good controller card.

"Zac" Jason Woodward
Network Administrator
Intermountain Electronics, Inc.
O: 877-544-2291
M: 435-820-6515
F: 435-637-9601
www.ie-corp.com

Creating customer confidence through extraordinary service and experienced industry experts.


-----Original Message-----
From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of John Driggers
Sent: Monday, February 27, 2012 9:25 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [Vantage] 15K vs. SSD Drives

Good point about the raid 5. In the beginning I'd kept mine on raid 10 not for performance as much as the reliability issues with some of the early SSDs coupled with the fact that our space requirements were pretty minimal.

It seems like the reliability issues have mostly been sorted out with the newer drives.

On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 11:18 AM, Michael Barry <mbarry@...> wrote:

> **
>
>
> Not only do you get a massive IOPS advantage but, perhaps just as
> important, you get a 1000 fold faster latency number. As a result,
> even the smallest queries display a remarkably improved response time.
> So much so, in fact, that just as you have observed you can absorb the
> additional overhead of virtualization and still see a significant
> improvement in system performance.
>
> An additional benefit of the write performance is that, if you are so
> inclined, you can pretty much abandon the whole raid 5 prohibition and
> get back some underutilized drive space...
>
> Michael
>
> Michael Barry
> Aspacia Systems Inc
> 866.566.9600
> 312.803.0730 fax
> http://www.aspacia.com/
>
>
> On Feb 27, 2012, at 6:24 AM, John Driggers wrote:
>
> > We did a few measurements, unfortunately I don't seem to have the
> > numbers anymore. However a quick google search should net you
> > countless studies/tests/benchmarks that show the massive IOPS
> > advantage that SSDs hold over traditional disks.
> >
> > Our database is inside a virtual disk, which as you probably know
> > already isn't recommended for performance. However our load wasn't
> > heavy enough
> to
> > justify a more complex storage arrangement. That said, we're
> > currently running our Epicor install (DB and all) on 4 SSDs in Raid
> > 10. We
> previously
> > had the DB running (non-virtual) on 6 15k SCSI drives in a RAID 10.
> > Even after the virtualization overhead, the performance increase is massive.
> >
> >
> > On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 7:26 AM, markbetts66
> ><mbetts@...
> >wrote:
> >
> >> **
>
> >>
> >>
> >> Hi,
> >>
> >> do you have any numbers at all for the performance improvement? Is
> >> your data base visualised too? which version of vantage are you running?
> >>
> >>
> >> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, John Driggers <waffqle@...> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> We are virtualized, so we gauged most of our performance by the
> >>> time it took to complete requests. Most of our IO bound loads were
> >>> were cut in half.
> >>> Our average disk queue length is pretty much always <1.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:42 PM, cubcrafters_it <
> >>> jason.navarrete@...> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> **
> >>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> I too, would like to know where the differences were seen. Any
> >> benchmarks
> >>>> ran?
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, Jose Gomez <jose@> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> 8 Drives.. I can't remember exactly what we had there before,
> >>>>> its
> >> been a
> >>>>> while. I'll deffer to John he may remember
> >>>>>
> >>>>> *Jose C Gomez*
> >>>>> *Software Engineer*
> >>>>> *
> >>>>> *
> >>>>> *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> >>>>> *
> >>>>> *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> >>>>> E: jose@
> >>>>
> >>>>> http://www.josecgomez.com
> >>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <
> >>>> http://www.facebook.com/josegomez>
> >>>>> <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <
> >>>> http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> >>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> >>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/> <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 1:07 PM, Vantage <vantage@> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> **
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> How many SSD drives do you have total running? And compared to
> >> what?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>>>> From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com]
> >>>>>> On
> >>>> Behalf
> >>>>>> Of Jose Gomez
> >>>>>> Sent: Thursday, February 23, 2012 11:56 AM
> >>>>>> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> >>>>>> Subject: Re: [Vantage] 15K vs. SSD Drives
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> When we moved to SSD's it make a HUGE difference.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> *Jose C Gomez*
> >>>>>> *Software Engineer*
> >>>>>> *
> >>>>>> *
> >>>>>> *checkout my new blog <http://www.usdoingstuff.com> *
> >>>>>> *
> >>>>>> *T: 904.469.1524 mobile
> >>>>>> E: jose@
> >>>>
> >>>>>> http://www.josecgomez.com
> >>>>>> <http://www.linkedin.com/in/josecgomez> <
> >>>> http://www.facebook.com/josegomez
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>> <http://www.google.com/profiles/jose.gomez> <
> >>>> http://www.twitter.com/joc85>
> >>>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/professional-resume/>
> >>>>>> <http://www.josecgomez.com/feed/> <http://www.usdoingstuff.com>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> *Quis custodiet ipsos custodes?*
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Thu, Feb 23, 2012 at 12:48 PM, Vantage <vantage@> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> **
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Just a general question. When looking at servers. Epicor wants
> >> more
> >>>>>>> spindles. SSD drives are more expensive, but much faster.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> What option would you go with?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Option 1 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal SSD
> >> drives.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Option 2 - Dell PowerEdge R810 server that has 6 internal -
> >>>>>>> 15K spindle drives and a DAS filled with a 15 - 15K drives?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Joe Sanders
> >>>>>>> Wipaire, Inc.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ------------------------------------
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note:
> >>>>>> You
> >> must
> >>>> have
> >>>>>> already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable
> >>>>>> access. )
> >>>>>> (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report
> >> Builder
> >>>> and
> >>>>>> Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> >>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> >>>>>> (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> >>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> >>>>>> (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> >>>>>> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> *John Driggers*
> >>> *High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
> >>> *
> >>> **:: 904.404.9233*
> >>> *:: waffqle@...*
> >>> *:: NO FAXES*
> >>>
> >>> *
> >>
> >>>
> >>> *
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > *John Driggers*
> > *High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
> > *
> > **:: 904.404.9233*
> > *:: waffqle@...*
>
> > *:: NO FAXES*
> >
> > *
> >
> > *
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
> >
> >
> > ------------------------------------
> >
> > Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You
> > must
> have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access.
> )
> > (1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report
> > Builder
> and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
> > (2) To search through old msg's goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
> > (3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto:
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links
> >
> >
> >
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
>



--
*John Driggers*
*High End Dev, System Design, Profit Drinking*
*
**:: 904.404.9233*
*:: waffqle@...*
*:: NO FAXES*

*

*


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



------------------------------------

Useful links for the Yahoo!Groups Vantage Board are: ( Note: You must have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to enable access. )
(1) To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report Builder and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/files/.
(2) To search through old msg's goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/messages
(3) To view links to Vendors that provide Vantage services goto: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/vantage/linksYahoo! Groups Links