Bad testing

I was sort of staying out of this thread, but for what its worth, I followed
the Epicor install manual's precisely and took double, triple, quadruple
precautions. My install went very smooth (11 hours from start to fully
functional on 18 workstations) I've had ONE issue that support helped
resolve (that one was my fault). Aside from users not finding things
immediately we've had no issues with the software. My users like the new
software, my boss is happy because there were only minor, (stress minor)
disruptions. I'll certainly contribute as much as possible with problems
and help when I can. Joe's heads up contribution of his issues was CRUCIAL
to my install effort. IT people are largely INVISIBLE to users and
management UNTIL there's a problem, then the line forms. I have no issues
with some venting. WHO ELSE can we vent to but our peers who face the same
problems. Management and users understand 1 word in 10 when we discuss our
issues. In the end responsibility falls on the VENDOR for the quality of
the product. Epicor is a good vendor with a quality product but THEY are
responsible for product quality.

Shirley Graver
(End User)
Sys Admin
Rubber associates Inc.
Cleveland/Akron



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I am very appreciative of Joe's Version 5 observations and bug list posts,
just as last year, I was very appreciative of Todd Anderson's long and
detailed negative experiences with Version 4. (Dr. Watson errors etc.,
system crashing, Progress and Vantage 4 problems, etc. etc.) Todd was not
alone in reporting Version 4 problems. I could understand the frustrations
that these early converts to the latest version of the product had then,
just as I understand that Joe is very frustrated now and letting others know
what to expect (or not to expect) from Version 5.

From the number of requests about Joe's bug lists and the updates to it, it
would appear there are many of us on the list who are very interested in
what those who have already updated to Version 5 have to say. How IS it
going for you, Shirley?

And I ditto John Sage's comments.

Vantage is a good product, support has been just that and has not let me
down yet. However, Quality Control of a product IS crucial to its
customers. Version 5 is a release, not in Beta testing. Customers expect
the product to function correctly, and when it doesn't, they get frustrated
and say so. There is a fine line between expressing oneself in an e-mail
message and the bashing or hot headed comments which can be a downer to
other members of the list. If, occasionally, someone crosses that line in
expressing their major frustrations, I can understand and overlook that too,
rather than not have the concrete information that is also being conveyed.
Joe's frustration is loud and clear. It is also quite apparent that he took
all his issues to Epicor first because they are the ones who can solve the
problems. He is doing the rest of us a favor by letting us know what
Version 5 issues are. I hope when the problem resolutions arrive, that Joe
will make his relief loud and clear too. In the meantime, I'm VERY
interested in what Joe, Shirley, and others are saying about Version 5.
We're reading and waiting before we convert to Version 5. This tatic worked
great with Version 4 as well.


Opinions of Deb Wilmoth


-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Konecny [mailto:jkonecn@...]


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
Well said Deb. I agree wholeheartedly. Not Epicor bashing for the sake of
bashing, but the facts cannot be denied. We are also wondering what to do
and all of the information is helpful in making a decision. Keep all of the
information coming gang.

-----Original Message-----
From: Wilmoth, Deb [mailto:Deb@...]
Sent: Monday, April 09, 2001 2:58 PM
To: 'vantage@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: RE: [Vantage] Bad testing


I am very appreciative of Joe's Version 5 observations and bug list posts,
just as last year, I was very appreciative of Todd Anderson's long and
detailed negative experiences with Version 4. (Dr. Watson errors etc.,
system crashing, Progress and Vantage 4 problems, etc. etc.) Todd was not
alone in reporting Version 4 problems. I could understand the frustrations
that these early converts to the latest version of the product had then,
just as I understand that Joe is very frustrated now and letting others know
what to expect (or not to expect) from Version 5.

From the number of requests about Joe's bug lists and the updates to it, it
would appear there are many of us on the list who are very interested in
what those who have already updated to Version 5 have to say. How IS it
going for you, Shirley?

And I ditto John Sage's comments.

Vantage is a good product, support has been just that and has not let me
down yet. However, Quality Control of a product IS crucial to its
customers. Version 5 is a release, not in Beta testing. Customers expect
the product to function correctly, and when it doesn't, they get frustrated
and say so. There is a fine line between expressing oneself in an e-mail
message and the bashing or hot headed comments which can be a downer to
other members of the list. If, occasionally, someone crosses that line in
expressing their major frustrations, I can understand and overlook that too,
rather than not have the concrete information that is also being conveyed.
Joe's frustration is loud and clear. It is also quite apparent that he took
all his issues to Epicor first because they are the ones who can solve the
problems. He is doing the rest of us a favor by letting us know what
Version 5 issues are. I hope when the problem resolutions arrive, that Joe
will make his relief loud and clear too. In the meantime, I'm VERY
interested in what Joe, Shirley, and others are saying about Version 5.
We're reading and waiting before we convert to Version 5. This tatic worked
great with Version 4 as well.


Opinions of Deb Wilmoth


-----Original Message-----
From: Joe Konecny [mailto:jkonecn@...]


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/
OK - enough already. Let's kill this topic.

Everyone agrees that we DO want to hear what the problems are. But as
moderators, part of our job is to keep people on-track with why the list was
developed in the first place. The reason we don't allow rants, the reason
we don't allow blatant advertising, the reason we discourage "me, too"
posts - is to make the list as valuable as possible. Reading 20 to 50
emails a day is livable as long as we don't have to wade through the junk.

Keep the information coming. Send your complaints to:

Mark Pladson mpladson@... eManufacturing Product Manager
Joe Jasper jjasper@...
George Klaus gklaus@... President/CEO
=================
Steve Sanders
Vantage List Moderator



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]