Profitability on RMA Rework Job

[system]

Patty



You are right, it does not show any COR or credit values on the Sales
Gross Margin Report



It only takes Sales Value and COS figures from the invcdtl table
(Invoice lines)



On a credit invoice line, the COS fields always show zero, as these are
usually generated by a shipment. The COR is in a separate tables.



In the past we have had to write a crystal report to show Shipment
invoices against invoice line COS and credit notes against the linked
RMA disposition in order to get it to reflect the P and L GM.



Gary



From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of bpbuechler
Sent: 30 September 2008 13:46
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job



Okay...at the point of dispostiion is when the COR hits. But my
question is why does it now show on the Sales Gross Margin report.

My steps are as follows:
My RMA is linked to a Sales Order Line/Release. When I dipositioned
the return, I choose back TO JOB (not FAIL). The per unit cost
buckets displayed a value and I didn't change them as they were
correct. It all went back to the Job on the WIP Material side (not
distributing it back to the costing buckets. I processed the Credit
and completed/closed the job. I then ran Capture and the WIP
Material cost is doubled.

My question is why does it not show the COR and Credit on the SGM?
Why are the costs double value?
How can I accurates show Sales Gross Margin when it does not include
these transactions?

Patty Buechler

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
"Gary Parfrey" <garyp@...> wrote:

>
> Patty
>
>
>
> There is no COR (Cost of Return) incurred at time of receipt. Cost

is

> only incurred at point of disposition in Vantage. If you have a COR
> account it goes there, else it goes to COS.
>
>
>
> One issue is that the cost can be overridden by the user in the
> disposition screen. I suppose depending on whether you have

credited

> the customer, is whether you enter zero cost or enter an actual

cost.

>
>
>
> Gary
>
>
>
> Dot Net IT Limited, Reg No 4412519
>
> From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

[mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ] On
Behalf

> Of bpbuechler
> Sent: 29 September 2008 16:33
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
>
>
>
> Funny...I just opened a call with Epicor on this very subject.
>
> When I receive an RMA I have two choices for disposition...FAIL
> (which would be to DMR) or back to JOB. In the scenario below...I
> assume you are going back to the JOB.
>
> We have the same question/issue as you do.
> What happens to COS $'s at the point of Receipt of the RMA?
> It would seem silly to have to do Job Cost Adjustment when the
> program is smart enough to know the value of each cost bucket at

the

> point of Receipt of the return. If the original sale and cos was by
> product group (GL Accounts) and if I don't have a Cost of Returns

GL

> Account associated to the Product Group, does this make the
> difference?
>
> Bottom line...Why does the Receipt of the RMA not reduce the SGM?
>
> Thanks
> Patty Buechler
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,

> "Geary, Stephanie" <sgeary@> wrote:
> >
> > I don't really know if this is your problem... but when you

receive

> an
> > RMA part it is valued at the cost your COS had incurred when it
> shipped.
> > So if your cost of sales was 1000 it would receive it back into
> > inventory at 1000. and if you sent it to a work order to be
> reworked
> > that value would of course follow it to the work order.
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> >
> > From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%
40yahoogroups.com> ] On

> Behalf
> > Of Randy
> > Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 5:00 PM
> > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> > Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> >
> >
> >
> > That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost $1,000.
> How
> > is it that you 'treat it as zero'?
> >
> > We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply a
> > small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
> > Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part is
> > also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the

job

> > for the cost of the parent.
> >
> > I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the only
> > company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The

fiz

> > is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.
> >
> > Anybody else with this experience?
> >
> > thanks,
> >
> > Randy Weber
> > IT Manager
> > TLC Electronics
> >
> > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
> > Robert Brown <robertb_versa@>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
> > >
> > > Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is your
> > sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then not
> > rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
> > shipment?
> > >
> > > We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value (and
> > technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in

our

> > hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good

customer 'good

> > will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are the
> > labor and any replacement parts we might use.
> > >
> > > Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job cost
> > adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the

RMA

> > returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and

you

> > were paid for it already on the original sale).
> > >
> > > Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this and
> has
> > a vantage process solution... (??)
> > >
> > > Rob Brown
> > >
> > > --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@> wrote:
> > >
> > > From: Randy <rweber@>
> > > Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> > > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Vantage 6.10.543
> > >
> > > When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the
> > Profitability
> > > and COGS goes out of whack.
> > >
> > > Example:
> > > Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on

an

> > RMA
> > > and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
> > >
> > > The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order

is

> > for
> > > zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on

the

> > job
> > > and my COGS goes up accordingly.
> > >
> > > Am I missing something?
> > >
> > > Randy Weber
> > >
> >
> >
> > This message has been processed via your triumphgroup.com e-mail
> > address.
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[system]

Vantage 6.10.543

When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the Profitability
and COGS goes out of whack.

Example:
Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on an RMA
and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.

The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order is for
zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on the job
and my COGS goes up accordingly.

Am I missing something?

Randy Weber

[system]

How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?

Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is your sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then not rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product shipment?

We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value (and technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in our hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good customer 'good will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are the labor and any replacement parts we might use.

Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job cost adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the RMA returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and you were paid for it already on the original sale).

Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this and has a vantage process solution... (??)

Rob Brown

--- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@...> wrote:

From: Randy <rweber@...>
Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM






Vantage 6.10.543

When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the Profitability
and COGS goes out of whack.

Example:
Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on an RMA
and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.

The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order is for
zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on the job
and my COGS goes up accordingly.

Am I missing something?

Randy Weber

[system]

That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost $1,000. How
is it that you 'treat it as zero'?

We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply a
small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part is
also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the job
for the cost of the parent.

I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the only
company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The fiz
is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.

Anybody else with this experience?

thanks,

Randy Weber
IT Manager
TLC Electronics




--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, Robert Brown <robertb_versa@...>
wrote:

>
> How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
>
> Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is your

sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then not
rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
shipment?

>
> We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value (and

technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in our
hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good customer 'good
will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are the
labor and any replacement parts we might use.

>
> Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job cost

adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the RMA
returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and you
were paid for it already on the original sale).

>
> Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this and has

a vantage process solution... (??)

>
> Rob Brown
>
> --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@...> wrote:
>
> From: Randy <rweber@...>
> Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Vantage 6.10.543
>
> When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the

Profitability

> and COGS goes out of whack.
>
> Example:
> Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on an

RMA

> and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
>
> The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order is

for

> zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on the

job

> and my COGS goes up accordingly.
>
> Am I missing something?
>
> Randy Weber
>

[system]

Randy,

Hmmm... We're on v8 .405a (and the behavior I just retested and will describe appears the same since we piloted it on one of the .3 releases).


IF material received via the RMA is clearly an RMA for a REPAIR (service) action, we DO NOT give the customer the typical financial CREDIT (net sold price less 30% for restocking/handling charges) we routinely give customers for RMAs specifically intended as stock adjustment returns. We give NO customer credits for RMA for repair receipts. The received material HAS NO VALUE (and technically, it is just in our care but not 'our' inventory).

(Stock Adjustment Returns" are a 'good will' practice that allows some of our public company customers to 'make their numbers right' prior to quarterly reporting, etc., - a process that internally is a physical pain in the rear but, financially, is a pin prick. Receipts from these RMAs DO carry a value and become our inventory.)

Once the RMA for repair material is received, the RMA issuing sales person enters and order (referencing the RMA) for a REPAIRS line item (a real non-stock/phantom part number in our system with a single OP and no material in its method) for a qty equalling whatever qty of product was returned for repair & received on the RMA.

Order Job WIzard then generates a linked/make-direct Job that Production Control edits to route the single OP through the correct resource for handling the repair of the returned product. We also use a generic production rate of 12 pc/hr (the average time it take to assemble/test & single pack most of our products). PC also adds any info provided by customer (via sales) that might help the assembler diagnose and correct the problem faster.

Traveler is printed and sent to QC who then dispositions the received DMR directly to the REPAIRS job.

From there, it is processed like any other assembly job. MES reported labor activity time produces a JobWIP labor cost... Any inventory required to fix the unit is added to the job details and then issued to the job (generating JobWIP material costs).

No where in that process does a value of the returned product for repair ever have a cost added to the JobWIP cost.

I just tested it start to finish in an up to date test db.


What are YOU doing differently that is somehow resulting in cost assignment to your RMA returned product - and then adds it to the repair JobWIP material value and throws off your single repair 'sale' COGs?

???

I'm VERY interested as it should provide additional insight into job costing and inventory valuation that will prove useful in the future.

Rob

--- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@...> wrote:

From: Randy <rweber@...>
Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 5:00 PM


That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost $1,000. How
is it that you 'treat it as zero'?

We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply a
small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part is
also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the job
for the cost of the parent.

I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the only
company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The fiz
is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.

Anybody else with this experience?

thanks,

Randy Weber
IT Manager
TLC Electronics

--- In vantage@yahoogroups .com, Robert Brown <robertb_versa@ ...>
wrote:
>
> How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
>
> Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is your
sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then not
rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
shipment?
>
> We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value (and
technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in our
hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good customer 'good
will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are the
labor and any replacement parts we might use.
>
> Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job cost
adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the RMA
returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and you
were paid for it already on the original sale).
>
> Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this and has
a vantage process solution... (??)
>
> Rob Brown
>
> --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@...> wrote:
>
> From: Randy <rweber@...>
> Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
> Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Vantage 6.10.543
>
> When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the
Profitability
> and COGS goes out of whack.
>
> Example:
> Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on an
RMA
> and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
>
> The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order is
for
> zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on the
job
> and my COGS goes up accordingly.
>
> Am I missing something?
>
> Randy Weber
>

[system]

I don't really know if this is your problem... but when you receive an
RMA part it is valued at the cost your COS had incurred when it shipped.
So if your cost of sales was 1000 it would receive it back into
inventory at 1000. and if you sent it to a work order to be reworked
that value would of course follow it to the work order.



________________________________

From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Randy
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 5:00 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job



That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost $1,000. How
is it that you 'treat it as zero'?

We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply a
small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part is
also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the job
for the cost of the parent.

I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the only
company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The fiz
is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.

Anybody else with this experience?

thanks,

Randy Weber
IT Manager
TLC Electronics

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
Robert Brown <robertb_versa@...>
wrote:

>
> How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
>
> Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is your

sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then not
rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
shipment?

>
> We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value (and

technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in our
hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good customer 'good
will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are the
labor and any replacement parts we might use.

>
> Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job cost

adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the RMA
returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and you
were paid for it already on the original sale).

>
> Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this and has

a vantage process solution... (??)

>
> Rob Brown
>
> --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@...> wrote:
>
> From: Randy <rweber@...>
> Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Vantage 6.10.543
>
> When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the

Profitability

> and COGS goes out of whack.
>
> Example:
> Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on an

RMA

> and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
>
> The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order is

for

> zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on the

job

> and my COGS goes up accordingly.
>
> Am I missing something?
>
> Randy Weber
>

This message has been processed via your triumphgroup.com e-mail
address.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[system]

Rob,

Thanks for your input. Late on Friday, we noticed something we had
never seen before that I think will shed some light on this (for me
anyway).

When we receive the part on the RMA into the job, the bottom of that
screen has a cost section that is already filled in with
MtlCost,Lbrcost,Burden, and SubContractCost. I assume it gets the
values from the original shipment via job-order link.

These values, if left alone, will follow their way through the process
and the result is that if you look at profitability for the part, it
looks real bad, as if you sold $1,000 worth of material for zero price
(with no Credit Memo used). Also, if you look at customer
tracker/invoices/invoice aging, the profitability is skewed
accordingly.

I found that if I zero those costs on the RMA receipt screen, it
appears to work out fine. Only the actual material/labor gets applied
to the job.

Finally, in the first scenario, where we have all these costs on the
job, it doesn't appear to effect my COGS. I tested twice and could not
find those dollars in the COGS.

It seems as though the only error is on the trackers; customer-
invoice-aging, part-profitability. Does this make sense?

Randy Weber

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, Robert Brown <robertb_versa@...>
wrote:

>
> Randy,
>
> Hmmm... We're on v8 .405a (and the behavior I just retested and will

describe appears the same since we piloted it on one of the .3
releases).

>
>
> IF material received via the RMA is clearly an RMA for a REPAIR

(service) action, we DO NOT give the customer the typical financial
CREDIT (net sold price less 30% for restocking/handling charges) we
routinely give customers for RMAs specifically intended as stock
adjustment returns. We give NO customer credits for RMA for repair
receipts. The received material HAS NO VALUE (and technically, it is
just in our care but not 'our' inventory).

>
> (Stock Adjustment Returns" are a 'good will' practice that allows

some of our public company customers to 'make their numbers right'
prior to quarterly reporting, etc., - a process that internally is a
physical pain in the rear but, financially, is a pin prick. Receipts
from these RMAs DO carry a value and become our inventory.)

>
> Once the RMA for repair material is received, the RMA issuing sales

person enters and order (referencing the RMA) for a REPAIRS line item
(a real non-stock/phantom part number in our system with a single OP
and no material in its method) for a qty equalling whatever qty of
product was returned for repair & received on the RMA.

>
> Order Job WIzard then generates a linked/make-direct Job that

Production Control edits to route the single OP through the correct
resource for handling the repair of the returned product. We also use
a generic production rate of 12 pc/hr (the average time it take to
assemble/test & single pack most of our products). PC also adds any
info provided by customer (via sales) that might help the assembler
diagnose and correct the problem faster.

>
> Traveler is printed and sent to QC who then dispositions the

received DMR directly to the REPAIRS job.

>
> From there, it is processed like any other assembly job. MES

reported labor activity time produces a JobWIP labor cost... Any
inventory required to fix the unit is added to the job details and
then issued to the job (generating JobWIP material costs).

>
> No where in that process does a value of the returned product for

repair ever have a cost added to the JobWIP cost.

>
> I just tested it start to finish in an up to date test db.
>
>
> What are YOU doing differently that is somehow resulting in cost

assignment to your RMA returned product - and then adds it to the
repair JobWIP material value and throws off your single repair 'sale'
COGs?

>
> ???
>
> I'm VERY interested as it should provide additional insight into job

costing and inventory valuation that will prove useful in the future.

>
> Rob
>
> --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@...> wrote:
>
> From: Randy <rweber@...>
> Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 5:00 PM
>
>
> That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost $1,000. How
> is it that you 'treat it as zero'?
>
> We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply a
> small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
> Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part is
> also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the job
> for the cost of the parent.
>
> I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the only
> company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The fiz
> is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.
>
> Anybody else with this experience?
>
> thanks,
>
> Randy Weber
> IT Manager
> TLC Electronics
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups .com, Robert Brown <robertb_versa@ ...>
> wrote:
> >
> > How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
> >
> > Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is your
> sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then not
> rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
> shipment?
> >
> > We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value (and
> technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in our
> hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good customer 'good
> will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are the
> labor and any replacement parts we might use.
> >
> > Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job cost
> adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the RMA
> returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and you
> were paid for it already on the original sale).
> >
> > Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this and has
> a vantage process solution... (??)
> >
> > Rob Brown
> >
> > --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@> wrote:
> >
> > From: Randy <rweber@>
> > Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> > To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
> > Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Vantage 6.10.543
> >
> > When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the
> Profitability
> > and COGS goes out of whack.
> >
> > Example:
> > Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on an
> RMA
> > and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
> >
> > The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order is
> for
> > zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on the
> job
> > and my COGS goes up accordingly.
> >
> > Am I missing something?
> >
> > Randy Weber
> >
>

[system]

Funny...I just opened a call with Epicor on this very subject.

When I receive an RMA I have two choices for disposition...FAIL
(which would be to DMR) or back to JOB. In the scenario below...I
assume you are going back to the JOB.

We have the same question/issue as you do.
What happens to COS $'s at the point of Receipt of the RMA?
It would seem silly to have to do Job Cost Adjustment when the
program is smart enough to know the value of each cost bucket at the
point of Receipt of the return. If the original sale and cos was by
product group (GL Accounts) and if I don't have a Cost of Returns GL
Account associated to the Product Group, does this make the
difference?

Bottom line...Why does the Receipt of the RMA not reduce the SGM?

Thanks
Patty Buechler

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "Geary, Stephanie" <sgeary@...> wrote:
>
> I don't really know if this is your problem... but when you receive
an
> RMA part it is valued at the cost your COS had incurred when it
shipped.
> So if your cost of sales was 1000 it would receive it back into
> inventory at 1000. and if you sent it to a work order to be
reworked
> that value would of course follow it to the work order.
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf
> Of Randy
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 5:00 PM
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
>
>
>
> That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost $1,000.
How
> is it that you 'treat it as zero'?
>
> We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply a
> small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
> Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part is
> also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the job
> for the cost of the parent.
>
> I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the only
> company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The fiz
> is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.
>
> Anybody else with this experience?
>
> thanks,
>
> Randy Weber
> IT Manager
> TLC Electronics
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
> Robert Brown <robertb_versa@>
> wrote:
> >
> > How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
> >
> > Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is your
> sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then not
> rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
> shipment?
> >
> > We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value (and
> technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in our
> hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good customer 'good
> will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are the
> labor and any replacement parts we might use.
> >
> > Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job cost
> adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the RMA
> returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and you
> were paid for it already on the original sale).
> >
> > Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this and
has
> a vantage process solution... (??)
> >
> > Rob Brown
> >
> > --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@> wrote:
> >
> > From: Randy <rweber@>
> > Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Vantage 6.10.543
> >
> > When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the
> Profitability
> > and COGS goes out of whack.
> >
> > Example:
> > Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on an
> RMA
> > and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
> >
> > The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order is
> for
> > zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on the
> job
> > and my COGS goes up accordingly.
> >
> > Am I missing something?
> >
> > Randy Weber
> >
>
>
> This message has been processed via your triumphgroup.com e-mail
> address.
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

[system]

True if you actually know the originating order and enter it in the RMA form.

If you are new to Vantage, that originating order won't even exist in the system (as it would be a legacy system record)...

In our case, we ARE new to Vantage, our customer service policies are such that we can get back product decades old (from a time before we had ANY computers) and even when product is returned, if the labelling is missing (becuase of the harsh environments our products are subjected to) we likely can't connect it to a specific originating order.

Rob

--- On Mon, 9/29/08, Geary, Stephanie <sgeary@...> wrote:

From: Geary, Stephanie <sgeary@...>
Subject: RE: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, September 29, 2008, 10:05 AM






I don't really know if this is your problem... but when you receive an
RMA part it is valued at the cost your COS had incurred when it shipped.
So if your cost of sales was 1000 it would receive it back into
inventory at 1000. and if you sent it to a work order to be reworked
that value would of course follow it to the work order.

____________ _________ _________ __

From: vantage@yahoogroups .com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups .com] On Behalf
Of Randy
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 5:00 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job

That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost $1,000. How
is it that you 'treat it as zero'?

We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply a
small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part is
also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the job
for the cost of the parent.

I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the only
company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The fiz
is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.

Anybody else with this experience?

thanks,

Randy Weber
IT Manager
TLC Electronics

--- In vantage@yahoogroups .com <mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com> ,
Robert Brown <robertb_versa@ ...>
wrote:
>
> How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
>
> Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is your
sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then not
rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
shipment?
>
> We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value (and
technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in our
hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good customer 'good
will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are the
labor and any replacement parts we might use.
>
> Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job cost
adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the RMA
returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and you
were paid for it already on the original sale).
>
> Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this and has
a vantage process solution... (??)
>
> Rob Brown
>
> --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@...> wrote:
>
> From: Randy <rweber@...>
> Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> To: vantage@yahoogroups .com <mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
> Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Vantage 6.10.543
>
> When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the
Profitability
> and COGS goes out of whack.
>
> Example:
> Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on an
RMA
> and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
>
> The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order is
for
> zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on the
job
> and my COGS goes up accordingly.
>
> Am I missing something?
>
> Randy Weber
>

This message has been processed via your triumphgroup. com e-mail
address.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[system]

Makes absolute sense. If you are referencing the originating Vantage order record when creating the RMA, it will definitely pull in the costs of that order.

The fact that it only seems to impact certain things is also not surprising. Vantage is a merging of multiple products over time so it is supporting a lot of parallel, similar table structures. It is not uncommon to use two tools that you THINK should show the same thing and they don't.

Rob

--- On Mon, 9/29/08, Randy <rweber@...> wrote:

From: Randy <rweber@...>
Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, September 29, 2008, 11:32 AM






Rob,

Thanks for your input. Late on Friday, we noticed something we had
never seen before that I think will shed some light on this (for me
anyway).

When we receive the part on the RMA into the job, the bottom of that
screen has a cost section that is already filled in with
MtlCost,Lbrcost, Burden, and SubContractCost. I assume it gets the
values from the original shipment via job-order link.

These values, if left alone, will follow their way through the process
and the result is that if you look at profitability for the part, it
looks real bad, as if you sold $1,000 worth of material for zero price
(with no Credit Memo used). Also, if you look at customer
tracker/invoices/ invoice aging, the profitability is skewed
accordingly.

I found that if I zero those costs on the RMA receipt screen, it
appears to work out fine. Only the actual material/labor gets applied
to the job.

Finally, in the first scenario, where we have all these costs on the
job, it doesn't appear to effect my COGS. I tested twice and could not
find those dollars in the COGS.

It seems as though the only error is on the trackers; customer-
invoice-aging, part-profitability. Does this make sense?

Randy Weber

--- In vantage@yahoogroups .com, Robert Brown <robertb_versa@ ...>
wrote:
>
> Randy,
>
> Hmmm... We're on v8 .405a (and the behavior I just retested and will
describe appears the same since we piloted it on one of the .3
releases).
>
>
> IF material received via the RMA is clearly an RMA for a REPAIR
(service) action, we DO NOT give the customer the typical financial
CREDIT (net sold price less 30% for restocking/handling charges) we
routinely give customers for RMAs specifically intended as stock
adjustment returns. We give NO customer credits for RMA for repair
receipts. The received material HAS NO VALUE (and technically, it is
just in our care but not 'our' inventory).
>
> (Stock Adjustment Returns" are a 'good will' practice that allows
some of our public company customers to 'make their numbers right'
prior to quarterly reporting, etc., - a process that internally is a
physical pain in the rear but, financially, is a pin prick. Receipts
from these RMAs DO carry a value and become our inventory.)
>
> Once the RMA for repair material is received, the RMA issuing sales
person enters and order (referencing the RMA) for a REPAIRS line item
(a real non-stock/phantom part number in our system with a single OP
and no material in its method) for a qty equalling whatever qty of
product was returned for repair & received on the RMA.
>
> Order Job WIzard then generates a linked/make- direct Job that
Production Control edits to route the single OP through the correct
resource for handling the repair of the returned product. We also use
a generic production rate of 12 pc/hr (the average time it take to
assemble/test & single pack most of our products). PC also adds any
info provided by customer (via sales) that might help the assembler
diagnose and correct the problem faster.
>
> Traveler is printed and sent to QC who then dispositions the
received DMR directly to the REPAIRS job.
>
> From there, it is processed like any other assembly job. MES
reported labor activity time produces a JobWIP labor cost... Any
inventory required to fix the unit is added to the job details and
then issued to the job (generating JobWIP material costs).
>
> No where in that process does a value of the returned product for
repair ever have a cost added to the JobWIP cost.
>
> I just tested it start to finish in an up to date test db.
>
>
> What are YOU doing differently that is somehow resulting in cost
assignment to your RMA returned product - and then adds it to the
repair JobWIP material value and throws off your single repair 'sale'
COGs?
>
> ???
>
> I'm VERY interested as it should provide additional insight into job
costing and inventory valuation that will prove useful in the future.
>
> Rob
>
> --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@...> wrote:
>
> From: Randy <rweber@...>
> Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
> Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 5:00 PM
>
>
> That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost $1,000. How
> is it that you 'treat it as zero'?
>
> We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply a
> small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
> Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part is
> also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the job
> for the cost of the parent.
>
> I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the only
> company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The fiz
> is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.
>
> Anybody else with this experience?
>
> thanks,
>
> Randy Weber
> IT Manager
> TLC Electronics
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups .com, Robert Brown <robertb_versa@ ...>
> wrote:
> >
> > How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
> >
> > Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is your
> sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then not
> rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
> shipment?
> >
> > We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value (and
> technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in our
> hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good customer 'good
> will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are the
> labor and any replacement parts we might use.
> >
> > Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job cost
> adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the RMA
> returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and you
> were paid for it already on the original sale).
> >
> > Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this and has
> a vantage process solution... (??)
> >
> > Rob Brown
> >
> > --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@> wrote:
> >
> > From: Randy <rweber@>
> > Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> > To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
> > Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Vantage 6.10.543
> >
> > When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the
> Profitability
> > and COGS goes out of whack.
> >
> > Example:
> > Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on an
> RMA
> > and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
> >
> > The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order is
> for
> > zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on the
> job
> > and my COGS goes up accordingly.
> >
> > Am I missing something?
> >
> > Randy Weber
> >
>

[system]

If you have shipped the part before and you don't know the original
purchase order .. I think it might actually use the "last" cost.



________________________________

From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Robert Brown
Sent: Monday, September 29, 2008 1:50 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job



True if you actually know the originating order and enter it in the RMA
form.

If you are new to Vantage, that originating order won't even exist in
the system (as it would be a legacy system record)...

In our case, we ARE new to Vantage, our customer service policies are
such that we can get back product decades old (from a time before we had
ANY computers) and even when product is returned, if the labelling is
missing (becuase of the harsh environments our products are subjected
to) we likely can't connect it to a specific originating order.

Rob

--- On Mon, 9/29/08, Geary, Stephanie <sgeary@...
<mailto:sgeary%40triumphgroup.com> > wrote:

From: Geary, Stephanie <sgeary@...
<mailto:sgeary%40triumphgroup.com> >
Subject: RE: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
Date: Monday, September 29, 2008, 10:05 AM

I don't really know if this is your problem... but when you receive an
RMA part it is valued at the cost your COS had incurred when it shipped.
So if your cost of sales was 1000 it would receive it back into
inventory at 1000. and if you sent it to a work order to be reworked
that value would of course follow it to the work order.

____________ _________ _________ __

From: vantage@yahoogroups .com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups .com] On
Behalf
Of Randy
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 5:00 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job

That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost $1,000. How
is it that you 'treat it as zero'?

We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply a
small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part is
also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the job
for the cost of the parent.

I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the only
company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The fiz
is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.

Anybody else with this experience?

thanks,

Randy Weber
IT Manager
TLC Electronics

--- In vantage@yahoogroups .com <mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com> ,
Robert Brown <robertb_versa@ ...>
wrote:

>
> How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
>
> Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is your

sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then not
rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
shipment?

>
> We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value (and

technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in our
hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good customer 'good
will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are the
labor and any replacement parts we might use.

>
> Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job cost

adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the RMA
returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and you
were paid for it already on the original sale).

>
> Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this and has

a vantage process solution... (??)

>
> Rob Brown
>
> --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@...> wrote:
>
> From: Randy <rweber@...>
> Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> To: vantage@yahoogroups .com <mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
> Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Vantage 6.10.543
>
> When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the

Profitability

> and COGS goes out of whack.
>
> Example:
> Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on an

RMA

> and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
>
> The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order is

for

> zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on the

job

> and my COGS goes up accordingly.
>
> Am I missing something?
>
> Randy Weber
>

This message has been processed via your triumphgroup. com e-mail
address.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


This message has been processed via your triumphgroup.com e-mail
address.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[system]

I see zeroes. Might be a result of us being relatively new on Vantage and there may not yet be an actual 'last cost' record.

We have 60,000 assembly configuration p/n's we brought over from our legacy system (potentially millions of option combos) so most individual part numbers go years with no activity. The handful of p/n's that do get constant activity rarely are returned so it may just be that we haven't experienced what you describe yet.

...Sounds like something else to pre-test on our development db so we know what to expect before it happens in the live system.

Thanks for the tip Stephanie. ;)

Rob

--- On Mon, 9/29/08, Geary, Stephanie <sgeary@...> wrote:

From: Geary, Stephanie <sgeary@...>
Subject: RE: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Date: Monday, September 29, 2008, 2:33 PM






If you have shipped the part before and you don't know the original
purchase order .. I think it might actually use the "last" cost.

____________ _________ _________ __

From: vantage@yahoogroups .com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups .com] On Behalf
Of Robert Brown
Sent: Monday, September 29, 2008 1:50 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job

True if you actually know the originating order and enter it in the RMA
form.

If you are new to Vantage, that originating order won't even exist in
the system (as it would be a legacy system record)...

In our case, we ARE new to Vantage, our customer service policies are
such that we can get back product decades old (from a time before we had
ANY computers) and even when product is returned, if the labelling is
missing (becuase of the harsh environments our products are subjected
to) we likely can't connect it to a specific originating order.

Rob

--- On Mon, 9/29/08, Geary, Stephanie <sgeary@triumphgroup .com
<mailto:sgeary% 40triumphgroup. com> > wrote:

From: Geary, Stephanie <sgeary@triumphgroup .com
<mailto:sgeary% 40triumphgroup. com> >
Subject: RE: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com <mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
Date: Monday, September 29, 2008, 10:05 AM

I don't really know if this is your problem... but when you receive an
RMA part it is valued at the cost your COS had incurred when it shipped.
So if your cost of sales was 1000 it would receive it back into
inventory at 1000. and if you sent it to a work order to be reworked
that value would of course follow it to the work order.

____________ _________ _________ __

From: vantage@yahoogroups .com [mailto:vantage@ yahoogroups .com] On
Behalf
Of Randy
Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 5:00 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job

That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost $1,000. How
is it that you 'treat it as zero'?

We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply a
small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part is
also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the job
for the cost of the parent.

I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the only
company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The fiz
is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.

Anybody else with this experience?

thanks,

Randy Weber
IT Manager
TLC Electronics

--- In vantage@yahoogroups .com <mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com> ,
Robert Brown <robertb_versa@ ...>
wrote:
>
> How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
>
> Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is your
sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then not
rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
shipment?
>
> We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value (and
technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in our
hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good customer 'good
will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are the
labor and any replacement parts we might use.
>
> Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job cost
adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the RMA
returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and you
were paid for it already on the original sale).
>
> Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this and has
a vantage process solution... (??)
>
> Rob Brown
>
> --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@...> wrote:
>
> From: Randy <rweber@...>
> Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> To: vantage@yahoogroups .com <mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
> Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Vantage 6.10.543
>
> When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the
Profitability
> and COGS goes out of whack.
>
> Example:
> Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on an
RMA
> and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
>
> The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order is
for
> zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on the
job
> and my COGS goes up accordingly.
>
> Am I missing something?
>
> Randy Weber
>

This message has been processed via your triumphgroup. com e-mail
address.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

This message has been processed via your triumphgroup. com e-mail
address.

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[system]

Patty



There is no COR (Cost of Return) incurred at time of receipt. Cost is
only incurred at point of disposition in Vantage. If you have a COR
account it goes there, else it goes to COS.



One issue is that the cost can be overridden by the user in the
disposition screen. I suppose depending on whether you have credited
the customer, is whether you enter zero cost or enter an actual cost.



Gary



Dot Net IT Limited, Reg No 4412519

From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of bpbuechler
Sent: 29 September 2008 16:33
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job



Funny...I just opened a call with Epicor on this very subject.

When I receive an RMA I have two choices for disposition...FAIL
(which would be to DMR) or back to JOB. In the scenario below...I
assume you are going back to the JOB.

We have the same question/issue as you do.
What happens to COS $'s at the point of Receipt of the RMA?
It would seem silly to have to do Job Cost Adjustment when the
program is smart enough to know the value of each cost bucket at the
point of Receipt of the return. If the original sale and cos was by
product group (GL Accounts) and if I don't have a Cost of Returns GL
Account associated to the Product Group, does this make the
difference?

Bottom line...Why does the Receipt of the RMA not reduce the SGM?

Thanks
Patty Buechler

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
"Geary, Stephanie" <sgeary@...> wrote:

>
> I don't really know if this is your problem... but when you receive

an

> RMA part it is valued at the cost your COS had incurred when it

shipped.

> So if your cost of sales was 1000 it would receive it back into
> inventory at 1000. and if you sent it to a work order to be

reworked

> that value would of course follow it to the work order.
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

[mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ] On
Behalf

> Of Randy
> Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 5:00 PM
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
>
>
>
> That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost $1,000.

How

> is it that you 'treat it as zero'?
>
> We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply a
> small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
> Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part is
> also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the job
> for the cost of the parent.
>
> I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the only
> company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The fiz
> is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.
>
> Anybody else with this experience?
>
> thanks,
>
> Randy Weber
> IT Manager
> TLC Electronics
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,

> Robert Brown <robertb_versa@>
> wrote:
> >
> > How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
> >
> > Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is your
> sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then not
> rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
> shipment?
> >
> > We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value (and
> technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in our
> hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good customer 'good
> will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are the
> labor and any replacement parts we might use.
> >
> > Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job cost
> adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the RMA
> returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and you
> were paid for it already on the original sale).
> >
> > Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this and

has

> a vantage process solution... (??)
> >
> > Rob Brown
> >
> > --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@> wrote:
> >
> > From: Randy <rweber@>
> > Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> > Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Vantage 6.10.543
> >
> > When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the
> Profitability
> > and COGS goes out of whack.
> >
> > Example:
> > Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on an
> RMA
> > and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
> >
> > The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order is
> for
> > zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on the
> job
> > and my COGS goes up accordingly.
> >
> > Am I missing something?
> >
> > Randy Weber
> >
>
>
> This message has been processed via your triumphgroup.com e-mail
> address.
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[system]

Okay...at the point of dispostiion is when the COR hits. But my
question is why does it now show on the Sales Gross Margin report.

My steps are as follows:
My RMA is linked to a Sales Order Line/Release. When I dipositioned
the return, I choose back TO JOB (not FAIL). The per unit cost
buckets displayed a value and I didn't change them as they were
correct. It all went back to the Job on the WIP Material side (not
distributing it back to the costing buckets. I processed the Credit
and completed/closed the job. I then ran Capture and the WIP
Material cost is doubled.

My question is why does it not show the COR and Credit on the SGM?
Why are the costs double value?
How can I accurates show Sales Gross Margin when it does not include
these transactions?

Patty Buechler

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "Gary Parfrey" <garyp@...> wrote:
>
> Patty
>
>
>
> There is no COR (Cost of Return) incurred at time of receipt. Cost
is
> only incurred at point of disposition in Vantage. If you have a COR
> account it goes there, else it goes to COS.
>
>
>
> One issue is that the cost can be overridden by the user in the
> disposition screen. I suppose depending on whether you have
credited
> the customer, is whether you enter zero cost or enter an actual
cost.
>
>
>
> Gary
>
>
>
> Dot Net IT Limited, Reg No 4412519
>
> From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf
> Of bpbuechler
> Sent: 29 September 2008 16:33
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
>
>
>
> Funny...I just opened a call with Epicor on this very subject.
>
> When I receive an RMA I have two choices for disposition...FAIL
> (which would be to DMR) or back to JOB. In the scenario below...I
> assume you are going back to the JOB.
>
> We have the same question/issue as you do.
> What happens to COS $'s at the point of Receipt of the RMA?
> It would seem silly to have to do Job Cost Adjustment when the
> program is smart enough to know the value of each cost bucket at
the
> point of Receipt of the return. If the original sale and cos was by
> product group (GL Accounts) and if I don't have a Cost of Returns
GL
> Account associated to the Product Group, does this make the
> difference?
>
> Bottom line...Why does the Receipt of the RMA not reduce the SGM?
>
> Thanks
> Patty Buechler
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
> "Geary, Stephanie" <sgeary@> wrote:
> >
> > I don't really know if this is your problem... but when you
receive
> an
> > RMA part it is valued at the cost your COS had incurred when it
> shipped.
> > So if your cost of sales was 1000 it would receive it back into
> > inventory at 1000. and if you sent it to a work order to be
> reworked
> > that value would of course follow it to the work order.
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> >
> > From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%
40yahoogroups.com> ] On
> Behalf
> > Of Randy
> > Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 5:00 PM
> > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> >
> >
> >
> > That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost $1,000.
> How
> > is it that you 'treat it as zero'?
> >
> > We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply a
> > small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
> > Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part is
> > also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the
job
> > for the cost of the parent.
> >
> > I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the only
> > company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The
fiz
> > is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.
> >
> > Anybody else with this experience?
> >
> > thanks,
> >
> > Randy Weber
> > IT Manager
> > TLC Electronics
> >
> > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
> > Robert Brown <robertb_versa@>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
> > >
> > > Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is your
> > sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then not
> > rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
> > shipment?
> > >
> > > We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value (and
> > technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in
our
> > hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good
customer 'good
> > will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are the
> > labor and any replacement parts we might use.
> > >
> > > Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job cost
> > adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the
RMA
> > returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and
you
> > were paid for it already on the original sale).
> > >
> > > Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this and
> has
> > a vantage process solution... (??)
> > >
> > > Rob Brown
> > >
> > > --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@> wrote:
> > >
> > > From: Randy <rweber@>
> > > Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> > > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Vantage 6.10.543
> > >
> > > When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the
> > Profitability
> > > and COGS goes out of whack.
> > >
> > > Example:
> > > Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on
an
> > RMA
> > > and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
> > >
> > > The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order
is
> > for
> > > zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on
the
> > job
> > > and my COGS goes up accordingly.
> > >
> > > Am I missing something?
> > >
> > > Randy Weber
> > >
> >
> >
> > This message has been processed via your triumphgroup.com e-mail
> > address.
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

[system]

I have to create my own GM report because at least in 6.1 the gross
margin report doesn't show credit memos or misc. invoices. It also
doesn't reflect any cost that is left on the job number and flows to COS
when the work order is closed. So I recreate a GM report that includes
these items as well as tracking the cost of goods returned. I have
never had the costs double though so I don't really know what that might
be.



________________________________

From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of bpbuechler
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 8:46 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job



Okay...at the point of dispostiion is when the COR hits. But my
question is why does it now show on the Sales Gross Margin report.

My steps are as follows:
My RMA is linked to a Sales Order Line/Release. When I dipositioned
the return, I choose back TO JOB (not FAIL). The per unit cost
buckets displayed a value and I didn't change them as they were
correct. It all went back to the Job on the WIP Material side (not
distributing it back to the costing buckets. I processed the Credit
and completed/closed the job. I then ran Capture and the WIP
Material cost is doubled.

My question is why does it not show the COR and Credit on the SGM?
Why are the costs double value?
How can I accurates show Sales Gross Margin when it does not include
these transactions?

Patty Buechler

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
"Gary Parfrey" <garyp@...> wrote:

>
> Patty
>
>
>
> There is no COR (Cost of Return) incurred at time of receipt. Cost

is

> only incurred at point of disposition in Vantage. If you have a COR
> account it goes there, else it goes to COS.
>
>
>
> One issue is that the cost can be overridden by the user in the
> disposition screen. I suppose depending on whether you have

credited

> the customer, is whether you enter zero cost or enter an actual

cost.

>
>
>
> Gary
>
>
>
> Dot Net IT Limited, Reg No 4412519
>
> From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

[mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ] On
Behalf

> Of bpbuechler
> Sent: 29 September 2008 16:33
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
>
>
>
> Funny...I just opened a call with Epicor on this very subject.
>
> When I receive an RMA I have two choices for disposition...FAIL
> (which would be to DMR) or back to JOB. In the scenario below...I
> assume you are going back to the JOB.
>
> We have the same question/issue as you do.
> What happens to COS $'s at the point of Receipt of the RMA?
> It would seem silly to have to do Job Cost Adjustment when the
> program is smart enough to know the value of each cost bucket at

the

> point of Receipt of the return. If the original sale and cos was by
> product group (GL Accounts) and if I don't have a Cost of Returns

GL

> Account associated to the Product Group, does this make the
> difference?
>
> Bottom line...Why does the Receipt of the RMA not reduce the SGM?
>
> Thanks
> Patty Buechler
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,

> "Geary, Stephanie" <sgeary@> wrote:
> >
> > I don't really know if this is your problem... but when you

receive

> an
> > RMA part it is valued at the cost your COS had incurred when it
> shipped.
> > So if your cost of sales was 1000 it would receive it back into
> > inventory at 1000. and if you sent it to a work order to be
> reworked
> > that value would of course follow it to the work order.
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> >
> > From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%
40yahoogroups.com> ] On

> Behalf
> > Of Randy
> > Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 5:00 PM
> > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> > Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> >
> >
> >
> > That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost $1,000.
> How
> > is it that you 'treat it as zero'?
> >
> > We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply a
> > small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
> > Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part is
> > also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the

job

> > for the cost of the parent.
> >
> > I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the only
> > company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The

fiz

> > is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.
> >
> > Anybody else with this experience?
> >
> > thanks,
> >
> > Randy Weber
> > IT Manager
> > TLC Electronics
> >
> > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
> > Robert Brown <robertb_versa@>
> > wrote:
> > >
> > > How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
> > >
> > > Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is your
> > sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then not
> > rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
> > shipment?
> > >
> > > We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value (and
> > technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in

our

> > hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good

customer 'good

> > will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are the
> > labor and any replacement parts we might use.
> > >
> > > Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job cost
> > adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the

RMA

> > returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and

you

> > were paid for it already on the original sale).
> > >
> > > Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this and
> has
> > a vantage process solution... (??)
> > >
> > > Rob Brown
> > >
> > > --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@> wrote:
> > >
> > > From: Randy <rweber@>
> > > Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> > > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Vantage 6.10.543
> > >
> > > When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the
> > Profitability
> > > and COGS goes out of whack.
> > >
> > > Example:
> > > Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in on

an

> > RMA
> > > and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
> > >
> > > The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order

is

> > for
> > > zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on

the

> > job
> > > and my COGS goes up accordingly.
> > >
> > > Am I missing something?
> > >
> > > Randy Weber
> > >
> >
> >
> > This message has been processed via your triumphgroup.com e-mail
> > address.
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

This message has been processed via your triumphgroup.com e-mail
address.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

[system]

We did as well...but it really stinks that Epicor cannot write a SGM
to accomodate functions that are part of Sales Gross Margin (+/-) and
part of standard functionality.
sorry...my two cents worth...
Patty Buechler

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "Geary, Stephanie" <sgeary@...> wrote:
>
> I have to create my own GM report because at least in 6.1 the gross
> margin report doesn't show credit memos or misc. invoices. It also
> doesn't reflect any cost that is left on the job number and flows
to COS
> when the work order is closed. So I recreate a GM report that
includes
> these items as well as tracking the cost of goods returned. I have
> never had the costs double though so I don't really know what that
might
> be.
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf
> Of bpbuechler
> Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 8:46 AM
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
>
>
>
> Okay...at the point of dispostiion is when the COR hits. But my
> question is why does it now show on the Sales Gross Margin report.
>
> My steps are as follows:
> My RMA is linked to a Sales Order Line/Release. When I dipositioned
> the return, I choose back TO JOB (not FAIL). The per unit cost
> buckets displayed a value and I didn't change them as they were
> correct. It all went back to the Job on the WIP Material side (not
> distributing it back to the costing buckets. I processed the Credit
> and completed/closed the job. I then ran Capture and the WIP
> Material cost is doubled.
>
> My question is why does it not show the COR and Credit on the SGM?
> Why are the costs double value?
> How can I accurates show Sales Gross Margin when it does not
include
> these transactions?
>
> Patty Buechler
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
> "Gary Parfrey" <garyp@> wrote:
> >
> > Patty
> >
> >
> >
> > There is no COR (Cost of Return) incurred at time of receipt.
Cost
> is
> > only incurred at point of disposition in Vantage. If you have a
COR
> > account it goes there, else it goes to COS.
> >
> >
> >
> > One issue is that the cost can be overridden by the user in the
> > disposition screen. I suppose depending on whether you have
> credited
> > the customer, is whether you enter zero cost or enter an actual
> cost.
> >
> >
> >
> > Gary
> >
> >
> >
> > Dot Net IT Limited, Reg No 4412519
> >
> > From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%
40yahoogroups.com> ] On
> Behalf
> > Of bpbuechler
> > Sent: 29 September 2008 16:33
> > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> >
> >
> >
> > Funny...I just opened a call with Epicor on this very subject.
> >
> > When I receive an RMA I have two choices for disposition...FAIL
> > (which would be to DMR) or back to JOB. In the scenario below...I
> > assume you are going back to the JOB.
> >
> > We have the same question/issue as you do.
> > What happens to COS $'s at the point of Receipt of the RMA?
> > It would seem silly to have to do Job Cost Adjustment when the
> > program is smart enough to know the value of each cost bucket at
> the
> > point of Receipt of the return. If the original sale and cos was
by
> > product group (GL Accounts) and if I don't have a Cost of Returns
> GL
> > Account associated to the Product Group, does this make the
> > difference?
> >
> > Bottom line...Why does the Receipt of the RMA not reduce the SGM?
> >
> > Thanks
> > Patty Buechler
> >
> > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
> > "Geary, Stephanie" <sgeary@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I don't really know if this is your problem... but when you
> receive
> > an
> > > RMA part it is valued at the cost your COS had incurred when it
> > shipped.
> > > So if your cost of sales was 1000 it would receive it back into
> > > inventory at 1000. and if you sent it to a work order to be
> > reworked
> > > that value would of course follow it to the work order.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > >
> > > From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> <mailto:vantage%
> 40yahoogroups.com> ] On
> > Behalf
> > > Of Randy
> > > Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 5:00 PM
> > > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost
$1,000.
> > How
> > > is it that you 'treat it as zero'?
> > >
> > > We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply
a
> > > small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
> > > Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part
is
> > > also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the
> job
> > > for the cost of the parent.
> > >
> > > I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the
only
> > > company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The
> fiz
> > > is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.
> > >
> > > Anybody else with this experience?
> > >
> > > thanks,
> > >
> > > Randy Weber
> > > IT Manager
> > > TLC Electronics
> > >
> > > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%
40yahoogroups.com>
> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
> > > Robert Brown <robertb_versa@>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
> > > >
> > > > Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is
your
> > > sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then
not
> > > rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
> > > shipment?
> > > >
> > > > We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value
(and
> > > technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in
> our
> > > hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good
> customer 'good
> > > will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are
the
> > > labor and any replacement parts we might use.
> > > >
> > > > Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job
cost
> > > adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the
> RMA
> > > returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and
> you
> > > were paid for it already on the original sale).
> > > >
> > > > Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this
and
> > has
> > > a vantage process solution... (??)
> > > >
> > > > Rob Brown
> > > >
> > > > --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > From: Randy <rweber@>
> > > > Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> > > > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > > Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Vantage 6.10.543
> > > >
> > > > When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the
> > > Profitability
> > > > and COGS goes out of whack.
> > > >
> > > > Example:
> > > > Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in
on
> an
> > > RMA
> > > > and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
> > > >
> > > > The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order
> is
> > > for
> > > > zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on
> the
> > > job
> > > > and my COGS goes up accordingly.
> > > >
> > > > Am I missing something?
> > > >
> > > > Randy Weber
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > This message has been processed via your triumphgroup.com e-mail
> > > address.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
> This message has been processed via your triumphgroup.com e-mail
> address.
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

[system]

You would think that the sales gross margin would tie to what Vantage
took to Cost of Sales for the month end but it doesn't... Many problems
with the SGM report. It can't be trusted fully.





________________________________

From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of bpbuechler
Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 9:01 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job



We did as well...but it really stinks that Epicor cannot write a SGM
to accomodate functions that are part of Sales Gross Margin (+/-) and
part of standard functionality.
sorry...my two cents worth...
Patty Buechler

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
"Geary, Stephanie" <sgeary@...> wrote:

>
> I have to create my own GM report because at least in 6.1 the gross
> margin report doesn't show credit memos or misc. invoices. It also
> doesn't reflect any cost that is left on the job number and flows

to COS

> when the work order is closed. So I recreate a GM report that

includes

> these items as well as tracking the cost of goods returned. I have
> never had the costs double though so I don't really know what that

might

> be.
>
>
>
> ________________________________
>
> From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

[mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ] On
Behalf

> Of bpbuechler
> Sent: Tuesday, September 30, 2008 8:46 AM
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
>
>
>
> Okay...at the point of dispostiion is when the COR hits. But my
> question is why does it now show on the Sales Gross Margin report.
>
> My steps are as follows:
> My RMA is linked to a Sales Order Line/Release. When I dipositioned
> the return, I choose back TO JOB (not FAIL). The per unit cost
> buckets displayed a value and I didn't change them as they were
> correct. It all went back to the Job on the WIP Material side (not
> distributing it back to the costing buckets. I processed the Credit
> and completed/closed the job. I then ran Capture and the WIP
> Material cost is doubled.
>
> My question is why does it not show the COR and Credit on the SGM?
> Why are the costs double value?
> How can I accurates show Sales Gross Margin when it does not

include

> these transactions?
>
> Patty Buechler
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,

> "Gary Parfrey" <garyp@> wrote:
> >
> > Patty
> >
> >
> >
> > There is no COR (Cost of Return) incurred at time of receipt.

Cost

> is
> > only incurred at point of disposition in Vantage. If you have a

COR

> > account it goes there, else it goes to COS.
> >
> >
> >
> > One issue is that the cost can be overridden by the user in the
> > disposition screen. I suppose depending on whether you have
> credited
> > the customer, is whether you enter zero cost or enter an actual
> cost.
> >
> >
> >
> > Gary
> >
> >
> >
> > Dot Net IT Limited, Reg No 4412519
> >
> > From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%
40yahoogroups.com> ] On

> Behalf
> > Of bpbuechler
> > Sent: 29 September 2008 16:33
> > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> > Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> >
> >
> >
> > Funny...I just opened a call with Epicor on this very subject.
> >
> > When I receive an RMA I have two choices for disposition...FAIL
> > (which would be to DMR) or back to JOB. In the scenario below...I
> > assume you are going back to the JOB.
> >
> > We have the same question/issue as you do.
> > What happens to COS $'s at the point of Receipt of the RMA?
> > It would seem silly to have to do Job Cost Adjustment when the
> > program is smart enough to know the value of each cost bucket at
> the
> > point of Receipt of the return. If the original sale and cos was

by

> > product group (GL Accounts) and if I don't have a Cost of Returns
> GL
> > Account associated to the Product Group, does this make the
> > difference?
> >
> > Bottom line...Why does the Receipt of the RMA not reduce the SGM?
> >
> > Thanks
> > Patty Buechler
> >
> > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
> > "Geary, Stephanie" <sgeary@> wrote:
> > >
> > > I don't really know if this is your problem... but when you
> receive
> > an
> > > RMA part it is valued at the cost your COS had incurred when it
> > shipped.
> > > So if your cost of sales was 1000 it would receive it back into
> > > inventory at 1000. and if you sent it to a work order to be
> > reworked
> > > that value would of course follow it to the work order.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > ________________________________
> > >
> > > From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> <mailto:vantage%
> 40yahoogroups.com> ] On
> > Behalf
> > > Of Randy
> > > Sent: Thursday, September 25, 2008 5:00 PM
> > > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > Subject: [Vantage] Re: Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > That's my question exactly - how can it 'appear' to cost

$1,000.

> > How
> > > is it that you 'treat it as zero'?
> > >
> > > We simply process the RMA, it goes right into the job. We apply

a

> > > small amount of labor and/or material and ship it back out, but
> > > Vantage thinks that the cost is $1,000 because the parent part

is

> > > also a component on the job, so it is effectively charging the
> job
> > > for the cost of the parent.
> > >
> > > I think it's because we don't issue a credit, but are we the

only

> > > company who doesn't bother with crediting and re-invoicing. The
> fiz
> > > is so small that it's not worth the extra effort.
> > >
> > > Anybody else with this experience?
> > >
> > > thanks,
> > >
> > > Randy Weber
> > > IT Manager
> > > TLC Electronics
> > >
> > > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%
40yahoogroups.com>

> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ,
> > > Robert Brown <robertb_versa@>
> > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > How can your RMA returned (for repair) part cost be $1,000?
> > > >
> > > > Do you credit the customer account for the return (and is

your

> > > sales revenue account knocked down for the return) - and then

not

> > > rebill them (full $1000 + labor & parts) upon repaired product
> > > shipment?
> > > >
> > > > We treat RMA material sent to us for repair as zero value

(and

> > > technically still the customer's ownership even though it is in
> our
> > > hands). Even if it is a no charge (warranty or good
> customer 'good
> > > will') repair, the only costs incurred on the repair job are

the

> > > labor and any replacement parts we might use.
> > > >
> > > > Seems to me you have to do some inventory value and/or Job

cost

> > > adjustments so you don't take the hit on the full value of the
> RMA
> > > returned material (since it really didn't cost you anthing and
> you
> > > were paid for it already on the original sale).
> > > >
> > > > Has to be a comptroller out there that has dealt with this

and

> > has
> > > a vantage process solution... (??)
> > > >
> > > > Rob Brown
> > > >
> > > > --- On Thu, 9/25/08, Randy <rweber@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > From: Randy <rweber@>
> > > > Subject: [Vantage] Profitability on RMA Rework Job
> > > > To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>

> <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
> > > > Date: Thursday, September 25, 2008, 3:14 PM
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Vantage 6.10.543
> > > >
> > > > When we rework a job that has come in under an RMA, the
> > > Profitability
> > > > and COGS goes out of whack.
> > > >
> > > > Example:
> > > > Part cost is 1,000 and sold for $2,000. We take the part in

on

> an
> > > RMA
> > > > and perform a small amount of rework - say $10.00.
> > > >
> > > > The job cost ends up being $1,010, and the rework sales order
> is
> > > for
> > > > zero dollars so my profitability looks like we lost $1,010 on
> the
> > > job
> > > > and my COGS goes up accordingly.
> > > >
> > > > Am I missing something?
> > > >
> > > > Randy Weber
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > This message has been processed via your triumphgroup.com e-mail
> > > address.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>
>
> This message has been processed via your triumphgroup.com e-mail
> address.
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

This message has been processed via your triumphgroup.com e-mail
address.



[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]