We can and do schedule with Vantage.
It is THE worst scheduler/capacity & method modeller I've ever had to deal with but it IS usable (& we achieve industry best customer service levels so our customers would back that up.)
To survive it, you have to minimize its ability to impact you (and keep your paradigms as simple as possible).
I would start with NOT forecasting out a year (you can honestly predict next year's conditions and needs down to a job detail level in this economy?!?) & minimizing the amount of work you are asking it to schedule to just what is necessary.
Same vein: Use Kanban processes where ever possible (reducing the scope of what you are asking it to schedule even further).
Forward schedule so assigned sched code priorities result in inuitively expected behavior.
Put a tight (BPM and/or customization enforced) activity & material transaction process (and then a solid job completion/closing process) so your schedules aren't junked up w/ hanging snippets of (systemic) incomplete OP load (that is physically completed: This will help your costing, shop management & inventory accuracy as well).
Or (as I responded before) if your company is not ready to do those things, adapt your existing excel tool to co-exist w/ Vantage until you ARE ready.
...I don't know what else to tell you. It is what it is & it is possible to minimize its weaknesses - but that will require some changes on the people process & company paradigm side (that would be smart to do anyway in all likelihood to make you more competitive).
Consider it (or throw up your hands and don't).
We knew when selecting Vantage it had an abysmal scheduler (but other things deemed as over-riding positives)... Maybe you didn't (but you stuck with it - so get creative & adapt to it).
Or don't (but then please don't ask.)
No magic bullets out there... PEOPLE executing well thought out, simple processes make companies successful - not ERP systems.
(The false lure & largely unfulfilled promises of ERP are best quickly mourned over upon that realization - their hand ful of benefits exploited, and there more numerous make-work abstacles & cost drivers minimized.)
Get on with it! Glad to offer more specific advice given more specific info.
I understand your frustration - but it can be overcome with rethinking of what you consider SOP process & rules.
Again: Glad to help if more info provided.
Rob Brown
--- Original Message ---
From:"Richard" <richard.larose@...>
Sent:Fri 8/6/10 2:38 pm
To:vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subj:[Vantage] Re: Scheduling Order !
"Are you loading out a year because actual customer requirments go out this far? OR is some/all of the 6-12 mo out loading some kind of forecasted (or Min+Safety MRP 'push') anticipated stock planning?"
=> We have forecasts and jobs go out this far.
Are you able to schedule with Vantage or not? Or do you know people they can ?
We have try many things and talk with many people (also with the master from Epicor - Stephen Gregory) and nobody show us that we can planned with Vantage...
But in fact, when I ask for scheduling at Epicor or to our local consultants nobody can tell us ONE compagny who use Vantage to schedule...
Rich
It is THE worst scheduler/capacity & method modeller I've ever had to deal with but it IS usable (& we achieve industry best customer service levels so our customers would back that up.)
To survive it, you have to minimize its ability to impact you (and keep your paradigms as simple as possible).
I would start with NOT forecasting out a year (you can honestly predict next year's conditions and needs down to a job detail level in this economy?!?) & minimizing the amount of work you are asking it to schedule to just what is necessary.
Same vein: Use Kanban processes where ever possible (reducing the scope of what you are asking it to schedule even further).
Forward schedule so assigned sched code priorities result in inuitively expected behavior.
Put a tight (BPM and/or customization enforced) activity & material transaction process (and then a solid job completion/closing process) so your schedules aren't junked up w/ hanging snippets of (systemic) incomplete OP load (that is physically completed: This will help your costing, shop management & inventory accuracy as well).
Or (as I responded before) if your company is not ready to do those things, adapt your existing excel tool to co-exist w/ Vantage until you ARE ready.
...I don't know what else to tell you. It is what it is & it is possible to minimize its weaknesses - but that will require some changes on the people process & company paradigm side (that would be smart to do anyway in all likelihood to make you more competitive).
Consider it (or throw up your hands and don't).
We knew when selecting Vantage it had an abysmal scheduler (but other things deemed as over-riding positives)... Maybe you didn't (but you stuck with it - so get creative & adapt to it).
Or don't (but then please don't ask.)
No magic bullets out there... PEOPLE executing well thought out, simple processes make companies successful - not ERP systems.
(The false lure & largely unfulfilled promises of ERP are best quickly mourned over upon that realization - their hand ful of benefits exploited, and there more numerous make-work abstacles & cost drivers minimized.)
Get on with it! Glad to offer more specific advice given more specific info.
I understand your frustration - but it can be overcome with rethinking of what you consider SOP process & rules.
Again: Glad to help if more info provided.
Rob Brown
--- Original Message ---
From:"Richard" <richard.larose@...>
Sent:Fri 8/6/10 2:38 pm
To:vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subj:[Vantage] Re: Scheduling Order !
"Are you loading out a year because actual customer requirments go out this far? OR is some/all of the 6-12 mo out loading some kind of forecasted (or Min+Safety MRP 'push') anticipated stock planning?"
=> We have forecasts and jobs go out this far.
Are you able to schedule with Vantage or not? Or do you know people they can ?
We have try many things and talk with many people (also with the master from Epicor - Stephen Gregory) and nobody show us that we can planned with Vantage...
But in fact, when I ask for scheduling at Epicor or to our local consultants nobody can tell us ONE compagny who use Vantage to schedule...
Rich
--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, robertb_versa@... wrote:
>
> 1. Are you loading out a year because actual customer requirments go out this far? OR is some/all of the 6-12 mo out loading some kind of forecasted (or Min+Safety MRP 'push') anticipated stock planning?
>
> If stock needs anticipation planning, unless you need to drive vendors on materials that far out, your forecast will almost assuredly prove wrong that far out & you'll spend more time/energy constantly tweaking the planning of it (and working around the resulting not proven to be needed loads in your shop). Better to spend your energy on process improvement (equipment, tooling, kanban, skills training internally & flexible cost effective supplier agreements externally).
> If you must schedule that far out, at least consider rough cut (Vantage's if good enough or trick it into handling your own more applicable paradigm). There is virtually no value in deluding yourself that some detailed finite schedule a year out will ever be executed as currently scheduled. (Your just making an already weak scheduling system work harder & with more data elements for no realistic payoff.)
>
> 2. Big shock: Epicor sales made claims the reality of the product can't fulfill (nor likely ever will). Epicor isn't alone in this (just perhaps more willing to do ANYTHING than most to win a sale). Since a handful of big companies began gobbling up the wide array of small market system providers that existed 15-20 yrs ago (a handful of which actually had some pretty unique & effective products that handled portions of manufacturing business needs mcu better than others), all this code merging has resulted in lowest common denominator featured products (many of which aren't as good as top tier products from the 80's).
> As a result, they appeal to CEO's with buzzwords, CIO's with the alluring scent of the newest programming paradigm & db base, and younger middle managers (who have only a handful at most of experiences with multiple older systems) with shallow promises of productivity enabling modules (that rarely live up to the hype) -
> All based upon 15 yrs of market brain washing that ERP works & is a 'must have' to succeed (when the REALITY is that ERP rarely delivers & is a HUGE ongoing cost to be endured for the majority of small to mid-sized manufacturers).
> - Again: focus on quality, process improvement (which can neg