Shop Load Quandaries

system · July 7, 2008, 8:01am

We too have struggled with the whole Resource Group/Resource
visibility. It was very evident to us that when Epicor came out with
V8 and the separation of Resource Groups and Resources along with
APS/Capabilities...they didn't do a very good job with separating
and breaking down to the Resource level...basic software
functionality and reporting.

I could send you (offline) my baq/dashboard that we use to forecast
load vs capacity. But as Robert Brown posted...the unfortunate is
the Load and Capacity tables are not real-time once an operation is
started. But for forecasting and filling gaps...for the most
part...it works for us. And yes...there will always have to be fine-
tuning to the schedule once all the chips fall after MRP/Global
Scheduling.

Thanks
Patty Buechler
UV Color

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "mdhoge" <mhoge@...> wrote:
>
>
> Patty
>
> My company has been struggling with the whole resource group and
> resource load visability. In theory we have resource groups that
> include resources in which sometime only can run certain parts,
thus
> there is always some manual jockeying of jobs after MRP is run. I
> would be curious to learn more about your custom report, if we have
a
> better understanding of near future load on various spefic
resources,
> it would help us greatly.
>
>
>
>
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "bpbuechler" <pbuechler@> wrote:
> >
> > Brad;
> >
> > Three tables:
> > ShopLoad
> > ShopCap
> > ResourceTimeUsed
> >
> > Four things that populate the data to the Resource Schedule Load
> > Graph (above and beyond Job Scheduling or running the Global
> > Scheduling process):
> >
> > 1. Generate Shop Capacity Process (System
Management>Utilities).
> It
> > should be a scheduled process running for however many days you
are
> > interested in seeing Capacity against load. We run it 4 times a
> day
> > as certain times a year we are hitting capacity and need to know
> > where the gaps are to quickly fill them.
> >
> > 2. zScheduleLoadGraph-COMPANYID (Executive Analysis>Business
> > Activity Management>General Operations>Schedule Process Set. The
> > built-in dashboard/graph is connected to executive queries that
> needs
> > to also be processed as a scheduled task.
> >
> > 3. Load Relieved by: Hrs or Qty (System Management>Company
> > Maintenance>Company) Load will remain on an Open job even if the
> > operation is marked complete. In otherwords, if you produce less
> > than the Planned Run Qty or Produce in a shorter timeframe than
> > Planned Hrs (Setup & Production combined). This one is probably
> > causing you the issue. I know it does for us as we consider the
> > operation complete when we hit Planned Production Qty for
> > the operation not the Planned Run Qty.
> >
> > 4. Job Closing/Completion (Production Management>General
> > Operations). Completing a job removes any outstanding load for
> > operations that are not complete and material allocations for
> > materials that are not issued complete.
> >
> > I have spent an extensive amount of time with shop load. I
> actually
> > built my own dashboard that (around the same concept as the
> standard
> > one) splits the graphing to a 6 month snap shot. This provides
our
> > company a more finite view of the load for the first 6 months and
a
> > forecast of the following 6 months. The only thing I could not
get
> > working in a dashboard is to then display the detail job load for
a
> > day/week/month/etc. Since the ResourceTimeUsed.LoadHours is an
~
> > separated field, you cannot query against it. So we had to build
a
> > new custom report; additionally to provide shop load by Resource
> not
> > Resource Group.
> >
> > I hope this helps...
> > Patty Buechler
> > UV Color
> >
> >
> > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "brychanwilliams"
> > <brychanwilliams@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > In v6.1 I did some investigation on this a long time ago.
> > >
> > > One report, contains unreleased load and as well as released.
> > >
> > > Firm/Unfirm may play a part as well. The load hours were stored
> in
> > an
> > > array . I think this is why it is a progress report, to aid the
> > > actual calculations per week. To verify this , look at the
tables
> > > involved.
> > >
> > > I don't know if it helps.
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "Feakes, Brad" <bfeakes@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > My company has been struggling with the Epicor's existing
> capacity
> > > > management tools since we went live in June (we're on 404).
> > > > Specifically, the Resource Schedule Load Graph and the Shop
> Load
> > > report
> > > > are producing different results, in terms of the load
> projections
> > by
> > > > week. In bumping these two reports against other indicators,
> it
> > > would
> > > > appear the Shop Load report is reporting the load projections
> > > > accurately, while the load graph is overstating load, even in
> past
> > > > periods where active jobs no longer exist.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > I understand the Resource Schedule Load Graph to be based on
> some
> > > system
> > > > BAQ's into the ShopLoad and ShopCap tables. Being that the
> Shop
> > > Load
> > > > report is a progress report, I have not been able to "get
under
> > the
> > > > hood" and identify how it is making its calculations, though
my
> > > > assumption is that the logic is different for the two
reports.
> My
> > > > Question-has anyone else out there experienced the same
> situation
> > > where
> > > > the two reports are telling different tales, and does anyone
> know
> > > why
> > > > this might be the case?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Brad Feakes
> > > >
> > > > Senior Business Systems Analyst
> > > >
> > > > Apogee ERP Core Team
> > > >
> > > > 715-302-5075
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > > >
> > >
> >
>

system · July 3, 2008, 6:36am

My company has been struggling with the Epicor's existing capacity
management tools since we went live in June (we're on 404).
Specifically, the Resource Schedule Load Graph and the Shop Load report
are producing different results, in terms of the load projections by
week. In bumping these two reports against other indicators, it would
appear the Shop Load report is reporting the load projections
accurately, while the load graph is overstating load, even in past
periods where active jobs no longer exist.

I understand the Resource Schedule Load Graph to be based on some system
BAQ's into the ShopLoad and ShopCap tables. Being that the Shop Load
report is a progress report, I have not been able to "get under the
hood" and identify how it is making its calculations, though my
assumption is that the logic is different for the two reports. My
Question-has anyone else out there experienced the same situation where
the two reports are telling different tales, and does anyone know why
this might be the case?

Brad Feakes

Senior Business Systems Analyst

Apogee ERP Core Team

715-302-5075

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

system · July 3, 2008, 6:57am

Hi,

In v6.1 I did some investigation on this a long time ago.

One report, contains unreleased load and as well as released.

Firm/Unfirm may play a part as well. The load hours were stored in an
array . I think this is why it is a progress report, to aid the
actual calculations per week. To verify this , look at the tables
involved.

I don't know if it helps.

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "Feakes, Brad" <bfeakes@...> wrote:
>
> My company has been struggling with the Epicor's existing capacity
> management tools since we went live in June (we're on 404).
> Specifically, the Resource Schedule Load Graph and the Shop Load
report
> are producing different results, in terms of the load projections by
> week. In bumping these two reports against other indicators, it
would
> appear the Shop Load report is reporting the load projections
> accurately, while the load graph is overstating load, even in past
> periods where active jobs no longer exist.
>
>
>
> I understand the Resource Schedule Load Graph to be based on some
system
> BAQ's into the ShopLoad and ShopCap tables. Being that the Shop
Load
> report is a progress report, I have not been able to "get under the
> hood" and identify how it is making its calculations, though my
> assumption is that the logic is different for the two reports. My
> Question-has anyone else out there experienced the same situation
where
> the two reports are telling different tales, and does anyone know
why
> this might be the case?
>
>
>
> Brad Feakes
>
> Senior Business Systems Analyst
>
> Apogee ERP Core Team
>
> 715-302-5075
>
>
>
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>

system · July 3, 2008, 7:37am

Brad;

Three tables:
ShopLoad
ShopCap
ResourceTimeUsed

Four things that populate the data to the Resource Schedule Load
Graph (above and beyond Job Scheduling or running the Global
Scheduling process):

1. Generate Shop Capacity Process (System Management>Utilities). It
should be a scheduled process running for however many days you are
interested in seeing Capacity against load. We run it 4 times a day
as certain times a year we are hitting capacity and need to know
where the gaps are to quickly fill them.

2. zScheduleLoadGraph-COMPANYID (Executive Analysis>Business
Activity Management>General Operations>Schedule Process Set. The
built-in dashboard/graph is connected to executive queries that needs
to also be processed as a scheduled task.

3. Load Relieved by: Hrs or Qty (System Management>Company
Maintenance>Company) Load will remain on an Open job even if the
operation is marked complete. In otherwords, if you produce less
than the Planned Run Qty or Produce in a shorter timeframe than
Planned Hrs (Setup & Production combined). This one is probably
causing you the issue. I know it does for us as we consider the
operation complete when we hit Planned Production Qty for
the operation not the Planned Run Qty.

4. Job Closing/Completion (Production Management>General
Operations). Completing a job removes any outstanding load for
operations that are not complete and material allocations for
materials that are not issued complete.

I have spent an extensive amount of time with shop load. I actually
built my own dashboard that (around the same concept as the standard
one) splits the graphing to a 6 month snap shot. This provides our
company a more finite view of the load for the first 6 months and a
forecast of the following 6 months. The only thing I could not get
working in a dashboard is to then display the detail job load for a
day/week/month/etc. Since the ResourceTimeUsed.LoadHours is an ~
separated field, you cannot query against it. So we had to build a
new custom report; additionally to provide shop load by Resource not
Resource Group.

I hope this helps...
Patty Buechler
UV Color

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "brychanwilliams"
<brychanwilliams@...> wrote:

>
> Hi,
>
> In v6.1 I did some investigation on this a long time ago.
>
> One report, contains unreleased load and as well as released.
>
> Firm/Unfirm may play a part as well. The load hours were stored in

an

> array . I think this is why it is a progress report, to aid the
> actual calculations per week. To verify this , look at the tables
> involved.
>
> I don't know if it helps.
>
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "Feakes, Brad" <bfeakes@> wrote:
> >
> > My company has been struggling with the Epicor's existing capacity
> > management tools since we went live in June (we're on 404).
> > Specifically, the Resource Schedule Load Graph and the Shop Load
> report
> > are producing different results, in terms of the load projections

by

> > week. In bumping these two reports against other indicators, it
> would
> > appear the Shop Load report is reporting the load projections
> > accurately, while the load graph is overstating load, even in past
> > periods where active jobs no longer exist.
> >
> >
> >
> > I understand the Resource Schedule Load Graph to be based on some
> system
> > BAQ's into the ShopLoad and ShopCap tables. Being that the Shop
> Load
> > report is a progress report, I have not been able to "get under

the

> > hood" and identify how it is making its calculations, though my
> > assumption is that the logic is different for the two reports. My
> > Question-has anyone else out there experienced the same situation
> where
> > the two reports are telling different tales, and does anyone know
> why
> > this might be the case?
> >
> >
> >
> > Brad Feakes
> >
> > Senior Business Systems Analyst
> >
> > Apogee ERP Core Team
> >
> > 715-302-5075
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> >
>

system · July 3, 2008, 9:55am

You are correct. These apps poke into the shop load rather than using actual current schedule info. I was told this was to allow 'what if' scheduling and assessment of results (without messing with actual schedules) but I suspect that is just cover.

More likely, the total system performance impact of using actual schedules was catastrophic so they created these mirror db tables to mitigate the problem.

From 305 thru 404 I've yet to see the actual shop schedule table info actually agree 100% with the shop load table info (even after a fresh Global reschedule - before any activity occurs).

Something (has always been) screwed up in the system processes that update the shop load tables.

The graphs are junk also. They never have appeared to represent the load in the shop load tables so I suspect you are correct in that the BAQs (or whatever they are using) that feed the graphs are trash.

I know of no planned fix of this but, since it is a 'bells and whistles' selling point app with little practical use in manufacturing schedule management, who cares.

Rob Brown

--- On Thu, 7/3/08, Feakes, Brad <bfeakes@...> wrote:

From: Feakes, Brad <bfeakes@...>
Subject: [Vantage] Shop Load Quandaries
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, July 3, 2008, 6:36 AM

My company has been struggling with the Epicor's existing capacity
management tools since we went live in June (we're on 404).
Specifically, the Resource Schedule Load Graph and the Shop Load report
are producing different results, in terms of the load projections by
week. In bumping these two reports against other indicators, it would
appear the Shop Load report is reporting the load projections
accurately, while the load graph is overstating load, even in past
periods where active jobs no longer exist.

I understand the Resource Schedule Load Graph to be based on some system
BAQ's into the ShopLoad and ShopCap tables. Being that the Shop Load
report is a progress report, I have not been able to "get under the
hood" and identify how it is making its calculations, though my
assumption is that the logic is different for the two reports. My
Question-has anyone else out there experienced the same situation where
the two reports are telling different tales, and does anyone know why
this might be the case?

Brad Feakes

Senior Business Systems Analyst

Apogee ERP Core Team

715-302-5075

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

system · July 3, 2008, 2:45pm

Patty

My company has been struggling with the whole resource group and
resource load visability. In theory we have resource groups that
include resources in which sometime only can run certain parts, thus
there is always some manual jockeying of jobs after MRP is run. I
would be curious to learn more about your custom report, if we have a
better understanding of near future load on various spefic resources,
it would help us greatly.

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "bpbuechler" <pbuechler@...> wrote:
>
> Brad;
>
> Three tables:
> ShopLoad
> ShopCap
> ResourceTimeUsed
>
> Four things that populate the data to the Resource Schedule Load
> Graph (above and beyond Job Scheduling or running the Global
> Scheduling process):
>
> 1. Generate Shop Capacity Process (System Management>Utilities).
It
> should be a scheduled process running for however many days you are
> interested in seeing Capacity against load. We run it 4 times a
day
> as certain times a year we are hitting capacity and need to know
> where the gaps are to quickly fill them.
>
> 2. zScheduleLoadGraph-COMPANYID (Executive Analysis>Business
> Activity Management>General Operations>Schedule Process Set. The
> built-in dashboard/graph is connected to executive queries that
needs
> to also be processed as a scheduled task.
>
> 3. Load Relieved by: Hrs or Qty (System Management>Company
> Maintenance>Company) Load will remain on an Open job even if the
> operation is marked complete. In otherwords, if you produce less
> than the Planned Run Qty or Produce in a shorter timeframe than
> Planned Hrs (Setup & Production combined). This one is probably
> causing you the issue. I know it does for us as we consider the
> operation complete when we hit Planned Production Qty for
> the operation not the Planned Run Qty.
>
> 4. Job Closing/Completion (Production Management>General
> Operations). Completing a job removes any outstanding load for
> operations that are not complete and material allocations for
> materials that are not issued complete.
>
> I have spent an extensive amount of time with shop load. I
actually
> built my own dashboard that (around the same concept as the
standard
> one) splits the graphing to a 6 month snap shot. This provides our
> company a more finite view of the load for the first 6 months and a
> forecast of the following 6 months. The only thing I could not get
> working in a dashboard is to then display the detail job load for a
> day/week/month/etc. Since the ResourceTimeUsed.LoadHours is an ~
> separated field, you cannot query against it. So we had to build a
> new custom report; additionally to provide shop load by Resource
not
> Resource Group.
>
> I hope this helps...
> Patty Buechler
> UV Color
>
>
> --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "brychanwilliams"
> <brychanwilliams@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > In v6.1 I did some investigation on this a long time ago.
> >
> > One report, contains unreleased load and as well as released.
> >
> > Firm/Unfirm may play a part as well. The load hours were stored
in
> an
> > array . I think this is why it is a progress report, to aid the
> > actual calculations per week. To verify this , look at the tables
> > involved.
> >
> > I don't know if it helps.
> >
> >
> > --- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "Feakes, Brad" <bfeakes@> wrote:
> > >
> > > My company has been struggling with the Epicor's existing
capacity
> > > management tools since we went live in June (we're on 404).
> > > Specifically, the Resource Schedule Load Graph and the Shop
Load
> > report
> > > are producing different results, in terms of the load
projections
> by
> > > week. In bumping these two reports against other indicators,
it
> > would
> > > appear the Shop Load report is reporting the load projections
> > > accurately, while the load graph is overstating load, even in
past
> > > periods where active jobs no longer exist.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > I understand the Resource Schedule Load Graph to be based on
some
> > system
> > > BAQ's into the ShopLoad and ShopCap tables. Being that the
Shop
> > Load
> > > report is a progress report, I have not been able to "get under
> the
> > > hood" and identify how it is making its calculations, though my
> > > assumption is that the logic is different for the two reports.
My
> > > Question-has anyone else out there experienced the same
situation
> > where
> > > the two reports are telling different tales, and does anyone
know
> > why
> > > this might be the case?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Brad Feakes
> > >
> > > Senior Business Systems Analyst
> > >
> > > Apogee ERP Core Team
> > >
> > > 715-302-5075
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
> > >
> >
>