8.03.405A from 6.10.543 intermittent errors, flakey stuff

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1
Could be Kerry.

Our IT manager (a true db WIZARD) set up the data mapping to bring our legacy system over (not an Epicor system) and, while we got about 99% right, it is the 1% that causes a little initial chaos.

I'd really look closely at ALL the connected datasets involved with the problematic behavior. You may find one little field came across inappropriately and is making the app misbehave.

If you've already done that: INSIST Support earn their money and fix it (as it is probably a bug.... The system is LACED with bugs but different users, who may use different aspects of the system to fit their business, only encounter some of them.)

Rob


--- On Thu, 12/18/08, Kerry_Muntz <kerry_muntz@...> wrote:

From: Kerry_Muntz <kerry_muntz@...>
Subject: [Vantage] Re: 8.03.405A from 6.10.543 intermittent errors, flakey stuff
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Date: Thursday, December 18, 2008, 2:12 PM






Thanks Jonathan, Linda and Rob for your feedback and ideas. All the
listed problems are very well documented, with video recordings,
showing they are the system and not humans blaming V8, and a couple
were observed by our contracted support. While I personally think there
could be more grunt in the server and in clients, I don't think that's
the primary issue (we do meet spec). Our database was converted to 8.
I am getting the message from other sources that this was probably not
a good idea, and I do now wish we'd done a cleaner dump n load with a
big mop at the ready... However I also wonder if there's something
broken in the integration layers (way outside my expertise).
2
This year we have upgraded to V8.03.405A from 6.10.543 and have been
in a world of pain. We are having unacceptable application failures,
flakey behaviour, and things that simply scare me.

I've been reading a lot of threads, and not read anything like our
nightmare. Does the following sound like anyone else's experience?
Does anyone have any ideas for us?
************
For example,
(1)We have had costs of parts going flakey on boms and quotes,
pulling costs of other parts that had been used to duplicate from
instead. This was happening on one afternoon - first time ever, and
the following working day all was well again, and we've never had a
repeat.

(2)We have had a bom not pick up the children of a subassemblies,
despite being pulled as assembly etc. The parts were removed and
added again, and all was well. Only ever seen this in one bom.

(3)We have had quotes suddenly becoming ticked as quoted, and unable
to be modified, despite not having engineered lines, and being unable
to 'unquote' it. The problem persisted on reboot, on different users
etc. Eventually just 'went away'. Very rarely occurs.

(4)In some windows with tree view, we've had the tree displaying one
lot of information, and the right hand panel information not
correlating. Intermittent.

(5)Every now and then, for short periods of time we find that our
search engines (eg in Part Tracker or Serial Tracker) do not sort the
data correctly, despite everything being entered correctly. The
exact same search performed on a neighbouring work station returns
different visual results. Intermittent.

(6)When I resequence in Engineering Workbench, I appear to have a
50/50 chance of throwing "Key already exists" errors.
************
And yet we can have days and weeks without problems. All of the
above are well documented and tested, and shown to not be human
error. Our external consultants are really not filling us with
confidence that our life will be better anytime soon. We use
Progress, and are on .NET 3.0
3
Kerry,
Â
You went from an old version to a new version and quite a leap you took. I don't think your going to find many suggestions on how to stop this from happening but one.
Â
I would suggest pulling out your Part, Customer, Vender, etc.. and load it back into Vantage making sure the fields all line up correctly. By doing this you are reseting the information in Vantage and allowing the system to reprocess the information.
Â
After doing this the system should settle down. You may have to fix a few small problems.
Â
Jonathan LangÂ
Oil Rite Corporation
Sr. Network Administrator
Ph: (920) 682-6173 Ext: 126
Fax: (920) 682-7699


--- On Wed, 12/17/08, Kerry_Muntz <kerry_muntz@...> wrote:

From: Kerry_Muntz <kerry_muntz@...>
Subject: [Vantage] 8.03.405A from 6.10.543 intermittent errors, flakey stuff
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, December 17, 2008, 2:33 PM






This year we have upgraded to V8.03.405A from 6.10.543 and have been
in a world of pain. We are having unacceptable application failures,
flakey behaviour, and things that simply scare me.

I've been reading a lot of threads, and not read anything like our
nightmare. Does the following sound like anyone else's experience?
Does anyone have any ideas for us?
************
For example,
(1)We have had costs of parts going flakey on boms and quotes,
pulling costs of other parts that had been used to duplicate from
instead. This was happening on one afternoon - first time ever, and
the following working day all was well again, and we've never had a
repeat.

(2)We have had a bom not pick up the children of a subassemblies,
despite being pulled as assembly etc. The parts were removed and
added again, and all was well. Only ever seen this in one bom.

(3)We have had quotes suddenly becoming ticked as quoted, and unable
to be modified, despite not having engineered lines, and being unable
to 'unquote' it. The problem persisted on reboot, on different users
etc. Eventually just 'went away'. Very rarely occurs.

(4)In some windows with tree view, we've had the tree displaying one
lot of information, and the right hand panel information not
correlating. Intermittent.

(5)Every now and then, for short periods of time we find that our
search engines (eg in Part Tracker or Serial Tracker) do not sort the
data correctly, despite everything being entered correctly. The
exact same search performed on a neighbouring work station returns
different visual results. Intermittent.

(6)When I resequence in Engineering Workbench, I appear to have a
50/50 chance of throwing "Key already exists" errors.
************
And yet we can have days and weeks without problems. All of the
above are well documented and tested, and shown to not be human
error. Our external consultants are really not filling us with
confidence that our life will be better anytime soon. We use
Progress, and are on .NET 3.0


















[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
4
Hi Kerry,



We've been on 8.03.403D for about 10 months and I remember having
problem number 3 at the beginning, but now that you mention it, I
realize that I haven't seen it for a while.



Your problem number 4 is still causing us problems in quote entry.
Sometimes, when the estimators delete a part in the manufacturing
details on a quote line they end up deleting an entire quote instead of
just the part. I have to keep reminding them to check the tree before
deleting anything. I was able to recreate it once on my computer when
it first started happening, but I can't anymore.



Linda









From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Kerry_Muntz
Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 3:33 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] 8.03.405A from 6.10.543 intermittent errors, flakey
stuff



This year we have upgraded to V8.03.405A from 6.10.543 and have been
in a world of pain. We are having unacceptable application failures,
flakey behaviour, and things that simply scare me.

I've been reading a lot of threads, and not read anything like our
nightmare. Does the following sound like anyone else's experience?
Does anyone have any ideas for us?
************
For example,
(1)We have had costs of parts going flakey on boms and quotes,
pulling costs of other parts that had been used to duplicate from
instead. This was happening on one afternoon - first time ever, and
the following working day all was well again, and we've never had a
repeat.

(2)We have had a bom not pick up the children of a subassemblies,
despite being pulled as assembly etc. The parts were removed and
added again, and all was well. Only ever seen this in one bom.

(3)We have had quotes suddenly becoming ticked as quoted, and unable
to be modified, despite not having engineered lines, and being unable
to 'unquote' it. The problem persisted on reboot, on different users
etc. Eventually just 'went away'. Very rarely occurs.

(4)In some windows with tree view, we've had the tree displaying one
lot of information, and the right hand panel information not
correlating. Intermittent.

(5)Every now and then, for short periods of time we find that our
search engines (eg in Part Tracker or Serial Tracker) do not sort the
data correctly, despite everything being entered correctly. The
exact same search performed on a neighbouring work station returns
different visual results. Intermittent.

(6)When I resequence in Engineering Workbench, I appear to have a
50/50 chance of throwing "Key already exists" errors.
************
And yet we can have days and weeks without problems. All of the
above are well documented and tested, and shown to not be human
error. Our external consultants are really not filling us with
confidence that our life will be better anytime soon. We use
Progress, and are on .NET 3.0





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
5
Sounds to me like you may occasionally be maxing out on processes (but doing so in a way that isn't fatal - just more dangerous as things don't get fully processed).

The CHANGING data is scarier. We're on 405a and don't experience it. Possible db corruption? (Try a dump and load?)

Other possibility (we HAVE experienced) - Users get SO fed up after a while they see problems everywhere and auto-blame the system.

Try setting up change logs where ever these data changes are occurring... Good chance it is user entry caused. (Very easy to make inadvertent errors with the sluggish GUI forms.)

Rob

--- On Wed, 12/17/08, Kerry_Muntz <kerry_muntz@...> wrote:
From: Kerry_Muntz <kerry_muntz@...>
Subject: [Vantage] 8.03.405A from 6.10.543 intermittent errors, flakey stuff
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Date: Wednesday, December 17, 2008, 3:33 PM











This year we have upgraded to V8.03.405A from 6.10.543 and have been

in a world of pain. We are having unacceptable application failures,

flakey behaviour, and things that simply scare me.



I've been reading a lot of threads, and not read anything like our

nightmare. Does the following sound like anyone else's experience?

Does anyone have any ideas for us?

************

For example,

(1)We have had costs of parts going flakey on boms and quotes,

pulling costs of other parts that had been used to duplicate from

instead. This was happening on one afternoon - first time ever, and

the following working day all was well again, and we've never had a

repeat.



(2)We have had a bom not pick up the children of a subassemblies,

despite being pulled as assembly etc. The parts were removed and

added again, and all was well. Only ever seen this in one bom.



(3)We have had quotes suddenly becoming ticked as quoted, and unable

to be modified, despite not having engineered lines, and being unable

to 'unquote' it. The problem persisted on reboot, on different users

etc. Eventually just 'went away'. Very rarely occurs.



(4)In some windows with tree view, we've had the tree displaying one

lot of information, and the right hand panel information not

correlating. Intermittent.



(5)Every now and then, for short periods of time we find that our

search engines (eg in Part Tracker or Serial Tracker) do not sort the

data correctly, despite everything being entered correctly. The

exact same search performed on a neighbouring work station returns

different visual results. Intermittent.



(6)When I resequence in Engineering Workbench, I appear to have a

50/50 chance of throwing "Key already exists" errors.

************

And yet we can have days and weeks without problems. All of the

above are well documented and tested, and shown to not be human

error. Our external consultants are really not filling us with

confidence that our life will be better anytime soon. We use

Progress, and are on .NET 3.0
6
Thanks Jonathan, Linda and Rob for your feedback and ideas. All the
listed problems are very well documented, with video recordings,
showing they are the system and not humans blaming V8, and a couple
were observed by our contracted support. While I personally think there
could be more grunt in the server and in clients, I don't think that's
the primary issue (we do meet spec). Our database was converted to 8.
I am getting the message from other sources that this was probably not
a good idea, and I do now wish we'd done a cleaner dump n load with a
big mop at the ready... However I also wonder if there's something
broken in the integration layers (way outside my expertise).
7
Hi,

We did something similar from 6.10.542 to 8.03.405. The main gripe is
speed and epicor are looking at this. We have, I believe, acceptable
hardware, we only have 6 primary users.

On issue 4, we have this in PO entry is causing an headache, this has
been confirmed by epicor. If I could get some speed then this would
make life easier. I really want to use BPM, but I am getting 3 sec
delay on transactions passing through BPM. This would lead me to
think it something in our setup but not sure.

I am tempted to do a dump and load but not sure if this is way
forward. Sorry not much help. I have found changing searches to BAQs
returns data quicker.

--- In vantage@yahoogroups.com, "Kerry_Muntz" <kerry_muntz@...> wrote:
>
> This year we have upgraded to V8.03.405A from 6.10.543 and have
been
> in a world of pain. We are having unacceptable application
failures,
> flakey behaviour, and things that simply scare me.
>
> I've been reading a lot of threads, and not read anything like our
> nightmare. Does the following sound like anyone else's
experience?
> Does anyone have any ideas for us?
> ************
> For example,
> (1)We have had costs of parts going flakey on boms and quotes,
> pulling costs of other parts that had been used to duplicate from
> instead. This was happening on one afternoon - first time ever,
and
> the following working day all was well again, and we've never had a
> repeat.
>
> (2)We have had a bom not pick up the children of a subassemblies,
> despite being pulled as assembly etc. The parts were removed and
> added again, and all was well. Only ever seen this in one bom.
>
> (3)We have had quotes suddenly becoming ticked as quoted, and
unable
> to be modified, despite not having engineered lines, and being
unable
> to 'unquote' it. The problem persisted on reboot, on different
users
> etc. Eventually just 'went away'. Very rarely occurs.
>
> (4)In some windows with tree view, we've had the tree displaying
one
> lot of information, and the right hand panel information not
> correlating. Intermittent.
>
> (5)Every now and then, for short periods of time we find that our
> search engines (eg in Part Tracker or Serial Tracker) do not sort
the
> data correctly, despite everything being entered correctly. The
> exact same search performed on a neighbouring work station returns
> different visual results. Intermittent.
>
> (6)When I resequence in Engineering Workbench, I appear to have a
> 50/50 chance of throwing "Key already exists" errors.
> ************
> And yet we can have days and weeks without problems. All of the
> above are well documented and tested, and shown to not be human
> error. Our external consultants are really not filling us with
> confidence that our life will be better anytime soon. We use
> Progress, and are on .NET 3.0
>
8
Hi Kerry,



We did not convert from our previous version. We started fresh and we
still ran into all kinds of flakey things.



Linda



From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Kerry_Muntz
Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 2:13 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] Re: 8.03.405A from 6.10.543 intermittent errors,
flakey stuff



Thanks Jonathan, Linda and Rob for your feedback and ideas. All the
listed problems are very well documented, with video recordings,
showing they are the system and not humans blaming V8, and a couple
were observed by our contracted support. While I personally think there
could be more grunt in the server and in clients, I don't think that's
the primary issue (we do meet spec). Our database was converted to 8.
I am getting the message from other sources that this was probably not
a good idea, and I do now wish we'd done a cleaner dump n load with a
big mop at the ready... However I also wonder if there's something
broken in the integration layers (way outside my expertise).





[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]