Finally went live with our first Kinetic screen today

We finally switched from classic to kinetic for Order Entry/Order Tracker today. It was one of our most heavily customized screens as well as having the most users, so probably the wrong one to start with, but, didn’t really have a choice since we desperately needed to make some changes and the classic version was corrupted (i.e. it would run, but try to touch it in developer mode and the whole thing fell apart).

It was a major struggle and I would not have been able to get it done without all the helpful info people post here.

My advice to everyone else is, upgrade to 2022 first. We are on 2021.2 and bugs and glitches in application studio, combined with the extremely incomplete documentation available, almost drove me to lose my mind. If I could have waited until after our next upgrade I would have. I have no plans to bring any other screens to kinetic until after we upgrade again.

That said, I love so much of the functionality available in application studio (if only it would work properly/reliably and if only it were documented!!!).


I understand its different in 2022, but for anyone still on 2021 and trying to figure out kinetic menus, here is what I did:
In Kinetic Application Maintenance, there is one node called Menu (all companies) which has all the shared menu items. If you expand that node, you will see Main Menu. If you toggle Enable New UI on the Main Menu node (or the other nodes at this level), it turns kinetic on or off for EVERYTHING below that node.

I flipped this on and then off again because we only wanted to enable the one screen - this ensured it was disabled for all menus.

Next, below Menu (all companies) is a separate node for each company.
If you don’t enable new UI for each company node, then you can’t use kinetic no matter what else you do, so I turned those on. If the company has any company-specific menu items, those nodes also appear when you expand the company, and can be turned on/off as well. I turned all of those off and only left it enabled at the top level.

Next I had to change my Order Entry and Order Tracker menu items to point to my kinetic customization. Support told me that I had to create new menu IDs by using “copy to current company” which I found preposterous - its 10 menu items x 3 companies - because there is no way in Menu Maintenance in 2021.2 to change a classic menu item to a kinetic menu item.

I continued to escalate the issue for many weeks and was finally provided with a data fix to switch a classic menu item to a kinetic menu item. FX_Upd_Menu_Kinetic.df.

So I queried ice.Menu for all the menus I needed to update to get the Menu IDs. Then I ran the data fix for each of them one by one. Then I went into menu maintenance, and applied the custom layer to each one.

My one complaint that is still not resolved is that it is impossible to turn off the “a new version of this app” message on any non-customized screen no matter what. The so called user override setting is a lie. Even if you have that turned off, the users will still see the message on any non-customized screen. The only way around it is to create a fake customization for each menu item (because the banner is hidden for customized screens), but that is way too much work. I understand that Epicor wants to encourage adoption, but this is the wrong way to do it. The control should lie with the system administrator not the individual user.


Thanks for pushing so hard to get that fix. I will definitely be upgrading to 2022.2 as soon as it’s available.

Way to go on completing the form with the most customizations!

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The nag bar? Oh there’s a way :smiling_imp: generally I don’t share the really hacky stuff but if you’re savvy recompile EpiClientLib’s property ShouldShowKineticAlert to return false with DnSpy and no more nag bar.

It’s especially frustrating because users, understandably, click crap the looks interesting and then get lost and we have to triage those calls. I like shiny things too!


I’m going to steal that trick! Thanks @jgiese.wci

I need to learn these things…

Im only 7mi away and I have Bud Light.

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I went home last night, set down my bag, and thought, “I really need to sit down with Haso.”

I won’t go as far as recompiling libraries but, do you happen to know where the number of days setting is stored? I can’t find it anywhere. 365 days would be way better than 45 days.

Yup! And I went for the lesser of two evils. It’s stored in user personalization.

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But surely its stored somewhere when you change the value in kinetic application maintenance first? Before it gets stored in their individual personalizations? Otherwise how does it know how long to snooze for in the personalization?

What screen is that snooze in?

Kinetic application maintenance

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Ice.SysConfig table
Key1 = KineticBannerSnoozeDays
SysCharacter01 holds the value.

It’s per company


You’re right!! Thanks!

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Could also change the value in a BPM.

Ice.Menu BO
UpdateKineticBannerSnooze pre-processing BPM
Update the “days” argument to whatever value you want and it would probably jam it through by force that way.

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Thanks for sharing this info with us! I am sure you won’t be the last to hack at it!

Nice job @aosemwengie1! We’re in the same boat, and I’m dreading uplifting Quote and Order Entry / Tracker to Kinetic. (Although I did get a fix for our broken classic grids - just delete the XML properties and that broken control reverts back to base!)

I’ll be asking for that data fix shortly. What a kludgy way to adopt Kinetic. It’s annoying enough to have to go to 10 menu entries x 3 companies. I usually open a dev environment on the side, so I can see what DLL it’s calling, since changing the app type to Kinetic wipes out the rest of the settings. Maybe someday I’ll make a updatable dashboard to streamline it, but Epicor should make this a lot easier out of the box. Sure, we can do it, but how much extra time are they burdening their classic customers? And multiply this by all the customizations the customer base has x menu instances x number of companies. Oof.

Every time I’ve talked a group into trying Kinetic for a day, there’s always a lack of some classic feature that prevents it, and I have to flip it back. Lately it’s been the inability to paste-insert a list into various filters in the search windows. No, support. We won’t do it one at a time for 50 lines x 5 people x 4 daily. We’re keeping those screens on classic until that’s resolved.

Nice job, that’s a big accomplishment.

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I was told the past-insert bug was fixed in 2021.2.25, but we haven’t updated to that version yet. It looks like you guys haven’t either?

Are you using the Menu Maintenance in Kinetic, that one doesn’t require an App Type Change anymore you can manage both Layers, however you won’t see the setting in Classic. Just want to make sure you arent duplicating your Menu’s unnecessarily :slight_smile: