Labor Collector Gateway Evaluation

We use a couple PCs (key/rodent) in the shop to collect data. The first problem I thought would be "spying" on the "innocents". A little of that, but mostly "data errors" by the "ignorant/lazy" was more of the problem. We never stopped using the paper
time tickets as well. Lot's of grumbling, but: A) people still mess up on the data. B) during power outages and other odd events, its nice to have data.

The PCs get pretty filthy, but haven't stopped working. By the way, take a look inside some office PCs sometime. Quite a bit of filth as well. The difference here (a machining environment) is that the filth in the shop is sticky/greasy type stuff, while
the office units collect dust bunny type stuff. I think the shop stuff is worse on human lungs than PCs. I think the shop greasy stuff tends to coat components - causing heating probs - while the office fluffy stuff tends to cause probs in drives and fans.

Operationally we have a person that must review each and every transaction to ensure accuracy. I feel it's worth it, because I can count on the data. Eventually I hope to phase out the time tickets, but never with new hires.

Best of luck...

Rick Gors
MR/MMIS
Osco

Horace Beale wrote:

> We are beginning the evaluation to add data collection. Can anyone share
> their experiences with the 2 alternatives: Labor Collector Gateway with TT5
> terminals vs. the VantagePoint Data Collection.
>
> I find it interesting that our Epicor sales rep is steering us away for the
> Gateway solution and I have noticed a few negative remarks in egroups.
>
> Any insight given will be appreciated.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Horace Beale
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
We are beginning the evaluation to add data collection. Can anyone share
their experiences with the 2 alternatives: Labor Collector Gateway with TT5
terminals vs. the VantagePoint Data Collection.

I find it interesting that our Epicor sales rep is steering us away for the
Gateway solution and I have noticed a few negative remarks in egroups.

Any insight given will be appreciated.

Sincerely,

Horace Beale


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
I tried the TT5's and had too many problems. I now have 7 Capio II's
running only Vantage Data Collection and it works great. We are not
live yeat but I have been using the Data Collection terminals for clock
in/out.

Ryan Larkin
Solid Comfort, Inc.

-----Original Message-----
From: Horace Beale [mailto:hbeale@...]
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2001 10:25 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] Labor Collector Gateway Evaluation


We are beginning the evaluation to add data collection. Can anyone
share
their experiences with the 2 alternatives: Labor Collector Gateway with
TT5
terminals vs. the VantagePoint Data Collection.

I find it interesting that our Epicor sales rep is steering us away for
the
Gateway solution and I have noticed a few negative remarks in egroups.

Any insight given will be appreciated.

Sincerely,

Horace Beale


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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Horace:
This is one subject that receives a good bit of discussion. I
suggest you go to your yahoogroups vantage profile and search on "labor
collect", "data collect", "TT5", etc and follow the threads. You'll get the
good, bad, and the ugly all in one stop.

Terry L. Williams I.S. Manager Chipsco, Inc. 9936 Liberty St. Ext.
Meadville, PA 16335 814-333-6331 fax: 814-337-2548 tlw@...
<mailto:tlw@...> www.chipsco.com <http://www.chipsco.com/>

-----Original Message-----
From: Horace Beale [mailto:hbeale@...]
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2001 11:25 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] Labor Collector Gateway Evaluation

We are beginning the evaluation to add data collection. Can anyone share
their experiences with the 2 alternatives: Labor Collector Gateway with TT5
terminals vs. the VantagePoint Data Collection.

I find it interesting that our Epicor sales rep is steering us away for the
Gateway solution and I have noticed a few negative remarks in egroups.

Any insight given will be appreciated.

Sincerely,

Horace Beale


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]




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[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
At 11:25 AM 4/17/2001 , you wrote:
>We are beginning the evaluation to add data collection. Can anyone share
>their experiences with the 2 alternatives: Labor Collector Gateway with TT5
>terminals vs. the VantagePoint Data Collection.

I've also been asked to look into it. We purchased the "Data Collection"
module with Vantage. Maybe I could run a few questions by everyone...

Does our Data Collection license include the Gateway / TT5 software?

Does a PC running the GUI data collection consume a full Vantage seat, or
will it run as a shop floor seat?

-Thanks,
Wayne Cox
"Does a PC running the GUI data collection consume a full Vantage seat, or
will it run as a shop floor seat?"

-A shop floor Pc with Vantage opened throught the datacollection icon will
use only a data collection license ($500 when we bought them) and will run
only data collections module and trackers.
We are running Data Collection on cheap sub $500 w/ mon. PCs and using
fairly good bar code scanners and this is working very well. No problems at
all. Data Collection seats are seperate from regular "Full" Vantage and
allow only DC and a couple of trackers. About 1/2 the users use the
keyboard, 1/4 mouse and 1/4 scanner. We will eventually push all to use the
scanner for accuracy. If I recall correctly from when we priced out the
system the cheap PCs were considerablly less than the cost of the TT5 route
and from comments posted here seem to be less headache. The TT5s may be
more rugged in a plant environment but PC components are cheap enough to
replace any single failure for under $90. I can also "promote" a PC to
full Vantage if needed or allow a supervisor to log in "full" from any shop
location. Not disparaging TT5s, I have no direct experience, just saying we
are very happy with PCs.

-Todd C.
Harvey Vogel Mfg. Co.

-----Original Message-----
From: Horace Beale [mailto:hbeale@...]
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2001 10:25 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [Vantage] Labor Collector Gateway Evaluation


We are beginning the evaluation to add data collection. Can anyone share
their experiences with the 2 alternatives: Labor Collector Gateway with TT5
terminals vs. the VantagePoint Data Collection.

I find it interesting that our Epicor sales rep is steering us away for the
Gateway solution and I have noticed a few negative remarks in egroups.

Any insight given will be appreciated.

Sincerely,

Horace Beale


[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]



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Horace,

You may want to forget both and consider a replacement for Epicor's solution
by Caesar Development. I have heard nothing but good things about the
product. I ordered a 30 day trial of it last week. I will update you when
I see it.

I have personally used both the TT5 and the Vantagepoint solutions and both
fall short of the mark when it comes to an efficient means of getting
information from the shop floor into Vantage. It is my feeling that Epicor
is moving away from the TT5 option and may completely phase it out. It
could be replaced with a wireless collection interface but that remains to
be seen. .

I can honestly say that allowing users to use the TT5 system in its present
state (ver 5.00.013 and previous) has severely harmed the future of data
collection in our plant. The system is unreliable and locks up at random
intervals. That's all it takes to give people a reason to lose confidence
in technology.

Not to mention the lack of stream lining in the input procedure. Scan in
for the day, scan into the job, scan out of the job, scan out for the day
all require the input of redundant information in multiple scans verses
grouping barcode data for minimal keystrokes or scans. These shortcomings
exist in the computer-based system as well, but at least it is pretty solid
for reliability.

If I were you I would compare the VantagePoint with the Caesar Development's
system and forget about TT5's all together. It isn't too often that I would
trust a salesperson...

Good luck,
Darren Mann
Miller Products Co.


> -----Original Message-----
> From: Horace Beale [mailto:hbeale@...]
> Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2001 10:25 AM
> To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
> Subject: [Vantage] Labor Collector Gateway Evaluation
>
>
> We are beginning the evaluation to add data collection. Can
> anyone share
> their experiences with the 2 alternatives: Labor Collector
> Gateway with TT5
> terminals vs. the VantagePoint Data Collection.
>
> I find it interesting that our Epicor sales rep is steering
> us away for the
> Gateway solution and I have noticed a few negative remarks in egroups.
>
> Any insight given will be appreciated.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Horace Beale
>
>
> [Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
>
>
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> To access the Files Section of our Yahoo!Group for Report
> Builder and Crystal Reports and other 'goodies', please go
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> must have already linked your email address to a yahoo id to
> enable access.
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>
We are also happy with using cheap Data Collection stations. From speaking
with several other Vantage admins, I have heard nothing that would recommend
the TT5 set-up. We used the light pens at first, but now all my data
collection stations are just the basic keyboard and mouse. We are moving
next spring and may add bar code readers at that time, but RF set up appeals
to me more...for flexibility in a bigger building. Also, even in a really
dirty environment, my biggest replacement cost is usually a network or video
card...I have monitors with 1992 manufacture dates out there.

Data Collection is really about convincing users you aren't "checking up" on
them, just trying to establish history of the jobs so that you can better
schedule your manufacturing. Then profit-sharing goes up! ;-)

Lydia



-----Original Message-----
From: Todd Caughey [mailto:caugheyt@...]
Sent: Tuesday, April 17, 2001 9:20 AM
To: 'vantage@yahoogroups.com'
Subject: RE: [Vantage] Labor Collector Gateway Evaluation

We are running Data Collection on cheap sub $500 w/ mon. PCs and using
""Does a PC running the GUI data collection consume a full Vantage seat, or
will it run as a shop floor seat?"
-A shop floor Pc with Vantage opened throught the datacollection icon will
use only a data collection license ($500 when we bought them) and will run
only data collections module and trackers."

This is true in Vantage 4 and 5. In Vantage 3, you could use Data Collection licenses as regular licenses also. It was kind of nice. Now that we are looking to 4.0, we are facing the music - Data Collection only works for Data Collection.

Troy Funte
Liberty Electronics




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