Depending on the version, you cannot close a job that is not completed
and on other versions, closing the job completes the job. In some
versions of the software, closing the job also wipes out the WIP while
others require another process prior to actually clearing the WIP. See
your help for more details.
Charlie Smith
2W Technologies LLC / Smith Business Services
From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Ari Footlik
Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 2:33 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
Good to know. But (correct me if I'm wrong) "Closing" the job doesn't
mark it as "Complete," does it? In which case, the job-ops would *not*
get cleared out, right?
--Ari
________________________________
From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
[mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ] On
Behalf
Of CharlieSmith
Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 12:27 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
V6 & V8 systems clear the jobs load when the job is completed. It clears
the material requirements when the job is closed.
Charlie Smith
2W Technologies LLC / Smith Business Services
From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
[mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ] On
Behalf
Of Robert Brown
Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 12:50 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
I don't know 6.1, but every system I've ever used clears out job op load
when the job is closed. If 6.1 doesn't, that is a HUGE system
housekeeping failure.
My sympathies for inheriting a v8 implementation... All the piloting in
the world isn't going to prepare you for the 'fun' of going live. V8
under full load conditions will reveal all kinds of issues to deal with
that piloting simply cannot reveal.
Good luck!
Rob
--- On Fri, 12/26/08, Ari Footlik <ari@...
<mailto:ari%40zweig-cnc.com>
<mailto:ari%40zweig-cnc.com>
<mailto:ari%40zweig-cnc.com> > wrote:
From: Ari Footlik <ari@... <mailto:ari%40zweig-cnc.com>
<mailto:ari%40zweig-cnc.com>
<mailto:ari%40zweig-cnc.com> >
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
Date: Friday, December 26, 2008, 9:38 AM
Hmmmm - are you sure "Closing" the jobs clears out the labor-records
from the op-center queues? We *do* try to close our jobs when they're
complete (the procedure for which is another pain I think we've
discussed before - I'm making progress on that front though). It just
looked to me like the queue had more in it than we had open jobs, but I
was only giving it a quick glance, not a thorough review...
As for why to upgrade? The upgrade was decided-upon and purchased long
before I arrived in the company; they were sold a bill-of-goods for some
new modules (which we don't really need). The executives were told the
upgrade would take two weeks - that was back in June of 2006 - and then
the guys who were running the IT stuff left the company. When I came
aboard I convinced them that their proposed schedule was ludicrous, but
we've had number of good trial-runs over the past year (even without
closing every open possible open-item), and we're hopefully prepared for
the switch. We could benefit from getting away from Report Builder and
using more Crystal - some of the reports the execs are asking for are
(IMHO) silly, but they're less silly when you don't have to write them
in RB, or better yet, when you can turn them into dashboards and grids
instead of paper...
--A
____________ _________ _________ __
From: vantage@yahoogroups .com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups .com] On
Behalf
Of Robert Brown
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2008 8:25 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
Ari - I think your 2nd point carries weight. Waiting for v8 (bringing
all those open job-ops/jobs over to v8) is going to add complication to
the data conversion process.
Isn't there some kind of mass job closing process in 6.1? If so, why not
force truly completed jobs closed? Perhaps that would then leave a much
smaller set of job-ops (for jobs not yet fully complete) that you can do
some heads down labor entries against to close out the ops?
I'm also curious about why you are planning a 6.1 to 8.03.40? upgrade.
What benefits are you expecting? (Why risk such business process
degrading/interrupt ing turmoil during a time of such economic turmoil?)
Rob
--- On Wed, 12/24/08, Ari Footlik <ari@zweig-cnc. com
<mailto:ari% 40zweig-cnc. com> > wrote:
From: Ari Footlik <ari@zweig-cnc. com <mailto:ari% 40zweig-cnc. com> >
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com <mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
Date: Wednesday, December 24, 2008, 12:49 PM
Rob -
Yes - when you process MRP in v6.1, you have two options: "Net Change"
or "Regeneration. " I assume "Regeneration" is akin to the Global option
in v8.
Maybe, though, I'll just put this off until we finally upgrade to v8...
My only concern is upgrading all those "open" items - I feel that the
upgrade will be faster/smoother if we have as few "open" items as
possible.
--A
____________ _________ _________ __
From: vantage@yahoogroups .com [mailto:vantage@ yahoogroups .com] On
Behalf
Of Robert Brown
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, :06 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
Glad to help Ari. I've never used 6.1 (we're on 8.03.405a) so I'm not
sure how to answer you're question.
On v8, MRP has a 'run scheduling' option - but it is deceptive. It ONLY
schedules new Unfirmed Jobs created by MRP.
Only the Global Rescheduler on v8 is capable of touching and
rescheduling all open jobs in the system. (I don't know if 6.1 even HAS
a separate Global scheduler - or if, on 6.1, MRP does everything
itself.)
So, on v8, if I were to use odbc to poke in OP completion on a boatload
of Job OPs, I'd need to run the global to actually clear out the
schedules. Using odbc simply changes the record data - but goes AROUND
any business object methods that would otherwise clear the load.
Don't know how that translates to 6.1... If 6.1 has some sort of
BAM/BPM'ish native server process waiting to detect an OP being set to
Complete (and the detected change then triggers it to do the
housekeeping and clear out load, cost accum, etc.,), then you may have
to do nothing after marking all your fouled up OPs as complete.
I have to believe there is SOME kind of batch scheduling utility on 6.1
that will clear out your false load once you punch in OP complete on all
those hanging-open job OPs.
Rob
--- On Tue, 12/23/08, Ari Footlik <ari@zweig-cnc. com
<mailto:ari% 40zweig-cnc. com> > wrote:
From: Ari Footlik <ari@zweig-cnc. com <mailto:ari% 40zweig-cnc. com> >
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com <mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
Date: Tuesday, December 23, 2008, 6:35 PM
Thanks, Rob. I was afraid it'd be something like that ;)
When you say, "You'll have to run the global" - do you mean the full MRP
re-calculation?
--Ari
PS - Happy Holidays to EVERYONE!!!
____________ _________ _________ __
From: vantage@yahoogroups .com [mailto:vantage@ yahoogroups .com] On
Behalf
Of Robert Brown
Sent: Saturday, December 20, :00 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
Subject: Re: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
Your job costs must be a mess (and at this point, too bad... you'll
never straighten it out as many have likely already been received).
If you feel like living a little dangerously (really not so dangerous -
but Epicor would frown on it) - using odbc (write capable) and simply
poke in true values into the 3 fields that fully mark an OP as complete.
They are in JobOpDtl & JobOper... not connected to work right now so I
can't quickly tell you the exact field names... just look at properly
processed OPs and compare to your unreported ones. It'll be obvious.
If your still nervous about it, open up Labor Entry in customization
mode and two of those fields are on the form... Get their names and the
3rd one will be easy to find as it is similarly named.
You'll have to run the global to clear out your actual schedules & the
load data.
Rob
--- On Fri, 12/19/08, Ari Footlik <ari@zweig-cnc. com
<mailto:ari% 40zweig-cnc. com> > wrote:
From: Ari Footlik <ari@zweig-cnc. com <mailto:ari% 40zweig-cnc. com> >
Subject: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com <mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
Date: Friday, December 19, 2008, 6:57 PM
I was just informed that the people in one of our work-centers *never*
actually start and end labor using MES. As such, there are literally
hundreds (if not thousands) of job/operations in the work-center queue
that have not been processed (and are, in turn, displayed as incomplete
in Job Tracker).
Is there a good way to clear all of these out? Can I mark the operation
as complete somewhere else in the system and have that, in effect, clear
the job out of the work-center queue?
Thanks.
--Ari
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
and on other versions, closing the job completes the job. In some
versions of the software, closing the job also wipes out the WIP while
others require another process prior to actually clearing the WIP. See
your help for more details.
Charlie Smith
2W Technologies LLC / Smith Business Services
From: vantage@yahoogroups.com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf
Of Ari Footlik
Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 2:33 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
Good to know. But (correct me if I'm wrong) "Closing" the job doesn't
mark it as "Complete," does it? In which case, the job-ops would *not*
get cleared out, right?
--Ari
________________________________
From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
[mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ] On
Behalf
Of CharlieSmith
Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 12:27 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
V6 & V8 systems clear the jobs load when the job is completed. It clears
the material requirements when the job is closed.
Charlie Smith
2W Technologies LLC / Smith Business Services
From: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
[mailto:vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com> ] On
Behalf
Of Robert Brown
Sent: Friday, December 26, 2008 12:50 PM
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
I don't know 6.1, but every system I've ever used clears out job op load
when the job is closed. If 6.1 doesn't, that is a HUGE system
housekeeping failure.
My sympathies for inheriting a v8 implementation... All the piloting in
the world isn't going to prepare you for the 'fun' of going live. V8
under full load conditions will reveal all kinds of issues to deal with
that piloting simply cannot reveal.
Good luck!
Rob
--- On Fri, 12/26/08, Ari Footlik <ari@...
<mailto:ari%40zweig-cnc.com>
<mailto:ari%40zweig-cnc.com>
<mailto:ari%40zweig-cnc.com> > wrote:
From: Ari Footlik <ari@... <mailto:ari%40zweig-cnc.com>
<mailto:ari%40zweig-cnc.com>
<mailto:ari%40zweig-cnc.com> >
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
To: vantage@yahoogroups.com <mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
<mailto:vantage%40yahoogroups.com>
Date: Friday, December 26, 2008, 9:38 AM
Hmmmm - are you sure "Closing" the jobs clears out the labor-records
from the op-center queues? We *do* try to close our jobs when they're
complete (the procedure for which is another pain I think we've
discussed before - I'm making progress on that front though). It just
looked to me like the queue had more in it than we had open jobs, but I
was only giving it a quick glance, not a thorough review...
As for why to upgrade? The upgrade was decided-upon and purchased long
before I arrived in the company; they were sold a bill-of-goods for some
new modules (which we don't really need). The executives were told the
upgrade would take two weeks - that was back in June of 2006 - and then
the guys who were running the IT stuff left the company. When I came
aboard I convinced them that their proposed schedule was ludicrous, but
we've had number of good trial-runs over the past year (even without
closing every open possible open-item), and we're hopefully prepared for
the switch. We could benefit from getting away from Report Builder and
using more Crystal - some of the reports the execs are asking for are
(IMHO) silly, but they're less silly when you don't have to write them
in RB, or better yet, when you can turn them into dashboards and grids
instead of paper...
--A
____________ _________ _________ __
From: vantage@yahoogroups .com [mailto:vantage@yahoogroups .com] On
Behalf
Of Robert Brown
Sent: Thursday, December 25, 2008 8:25 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
Ari - I think your 2nd point carries weight. Waiting for v8 (bringing
all those open job-ops/jobs over to v8) is going to add complication to
the data conversion process.
Isn't there some kind of mass job closing process in 6.1? If so, why not
force truly completed jobs closed? Perhaps that would then leave a much
smaller set of job-ops (for jobs not yet fully complete) that you can do
some heads down labor entries against to close out the ops?
I'm also curious about why you are planning a 6.1 to 8.03.40? upgrade.
What benefits are you expecting? (Why risk such business process
degrading/interrupt ing turmoil during a time of such economic turmoil?)
Rob
--- On Wed, 12/24/08, Ari Footlik <ari@zweig-cnc. com
<mailto:ari% 40zweig-cnc. com> > wrote:
From: Ari Footlik <ari@zweig-cnc. com <mailto:ari% 40zweig-cnc. com> >
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com <mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
Date: Wednesday, December 24, 2008, 12:49 PM
Rob -
Yes - when you process MRP in v6.1, you have two options: "Net Change"
or "Regeneration. " I assume "Regeneration" is akin to the Global option
in v8.
Maybe, though, I'll just put this off until we finally upgrade to v8...
My only concern is upgrading all those "open" items - I feel that the
upgrade will be faster/smoother if we have as few "open" items as
possible.
--A
____________ _________ _________ __
From: vantage@yahoogroups .com [mailto:vantage@ yahoogroups .com] On
Behalf
Of Robert Brown
Sent: Wednesday, December 24, :06 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
Glad to help Ari. I've never used 6.1 (we're on 8.03.405a) so I'm not
sure how to answer you're question.
On v8, MRP has a 'run scheduling' option - but it is deceptive. It ONLY
schedules new Unfirmed Jobs created by MRP.
Only the Global Rescheduler on v8 is capable of touching and
rescheduling all open jobs in the system. (I don't know if 6.1 even HAS
a separate Global scheduler - or if, on 6.1, MRP does everything
itself.)
So, on v8, if I were to use odbc to poke in OP completion on a boatload
of Job OPs, I'd need to run the global to actually clear out the
schedules. Using odbc simply changes the record data - but goes AROUND
any business object methods that would otherwise clear the load.
Don't know how that translates to 6.1... If 6.1 has some sort of
BAM/BPM'ish native server process waiting to detect an OP being set to
Complete (and the detected change then triggers it to do the
housekeeping and clear out load, cost accum, etc.,), then you may have
to do nothing after marking all your fouled up OPs as complete.
I have to believe there is SOME kind of batch scheduling utility on 6.1
that will clear out your false load once you punch in OP complete on all
those hanging-open job OPs.
Rob
--- On Tue, 12/23/08, Ari Footlik <ari@zweig-cnc. com
<mailto:ari% 40zweig-cnc. com> > wrote:
From: Ari Footlik <ari@zweig-cnc. com <mailto:ari% 40zweig-cnc. com> >
Subject: RE: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com <mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
Date: Tuesday, December 23, 2008, 6:35 PM
Thanks, Rob. I was afraid it'd be something like that ;)
When you say, "You'll have to run the global" - do you mean the full MRP
re-calculation?
--Ari
PS - Happy Holidays to EVERYONE!!!
____________ _________ _________ __
From: vantage@yahoogroups .com [mailto:vantage@ yahoogroups .com] On
Behalf
Of Robert Brown
Sent: Saturday, December 20, :00 AM
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com
Subject: Re: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
Your job costs must be a mess (and at this point, too bad... you'll
never straighten it out as many have likely already been received).
If you feel like living a little dangerously (really not so dangerous -
but Epicor would frown on it) - using odbc (write capable) and simply
poke in true values into the 3 fields that fully mark an OP as complete.
They are in JobOpDtl & JobOper... not connected to work right now so I
can't quickly tell you the exact field names... just look at properly
processed OPs and compare to your unreported ones. It'll be obvious.
If your still nervous about it, open up Labor Entry in customization
mode and two of those fields are on the form... Get their names and the
3rd one will be easy to find as it is similarly named.
You'll have to run the global to clear out your actual schedules & the
load data.
Rob
--- On Fri, 12/19/08, Ari Footlik <ari@zweig-cnc. com
<mailto:ari% 40zweig-cnc. com> > wrote:
From: Ari Footlik <ari@zweig-cnc. com <mailto:ari% 40zweig-cnc. com> >
Subject: [Vantage] v6.1 Abandoned Jobs in MES
To: vantage@yahoogroups .com <mailto:vantage% 40yahoogroups. com>
Date: Friday, December 19, 2008, 6:57 PM
I was just informed that the people in one of our work-centers *never*
actually start and end labor using MES. As such, there are literally
hundreds (if not thousands) of job/operations in the work-center queue
that have not been processed (and are, in turn, displayed as incomplete
in Job Tracker).
Is there a good way to clear all of these out? Can I mark the operation
as complete somewhere else in the system and have that, in effect, clear
the job out of the work-center queue?
Thanks.
--Ari
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]
[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]